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:Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2012 October 4#Regional Municipality of York categories

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= October 4 =

== Category:Bhangra ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: no consensus.--Mike Selinker (talk) 21:00, 4 November 2012 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Bhangra to :Category:Bhangra (music)

:* Split :Category:Bhangra to :Category:Bhangra (music) and :Category:Bhangra (dance), use {{tl|catseealso}} to link the two.

:Nominator's rationale: Main article is dab. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 18:43, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

  • Oppose. The page Bhangra is indeed a dab, but there is both Bhangra (music) and Bhangra (dance). This category appears to refer to both the dance and the music; it is a subcat both of :Category:Dances of India and of music categs such as {{cl|Pakistani styles of music}} and {{cl|Punjabi music}}.
    A move seems wrong, because it would narrow the scope. A split may be appropriate, but I know too little about the genre to decide. I suggest notifying the relevant WikiProjects, to seek expert input. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:29, 12 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Split per nom.John Pack Lambert (talk) 03:27, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Steampunk music ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: delete. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 15:31, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

:*RELISTED. Following discussions with interested editors, this discussion has been relisted at CFD 2012 November 14. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:22, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

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:* Propose deleting {{Lc|Steampunk music}}

:Nominator's rationale: There is no main article for this genre and the section on it explicitly states how it's ill-defined. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 18:29, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

  • Delete per nominator. Steam5 (talk) 18:30, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • keep Although the style of the music genre within steampunk has remained infamously eclectic, the bands within that scene are clearly identified. It would be very difficult to write an article on "steampunk music", but it's very easy to define and source the categorization of "the musicians of steampunk". Andy Dingley (talk) 18:34, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Delete as not defined enough of a genre to categoize things in it.John Pack Lambert (talk) 03:28, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Lists of Australian biota ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Rename - jc37 04:32, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Lists of Australian biota to :Category:Lists of biota of Australia

:added 7 October by BHG

:* :Category:Lists of Canadian biota to :Category:Lists of biota of Canada

:Nominator's rationale: Rename per convention of :Category:Lists of biota by country. This may appear to be eligible for speedy renaming per speedy criterion C2C, but most of the other subcategories have been recently created by me, so I think that a speedy would be inappropriate. BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:03, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Pixar's Up ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: speedy rename per speedy criterion C2D. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:40, 6 October 2012 (UTC)

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:* Propose renaming :Category:Pixar's Up to :Category:Up (2009 film)

:Nominator's rationale: Rename. To match title of main article. Trivialist (talk) 17:03, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

  • Rename per nominator. Steam5 (talk) 18:03, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:American country musicians ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Thanks for making me clean up the whole damn thing myself. I really appreciate all the help.

:* Propose deleting {{Lc|American country musicians}}

:Nominator's rationale: Seems redundant. Everything here is already in :Category:American country singers as well. Is a singer not a musician? (Also, if they play another instrument, they should already be categorized by what they play, such as :Category:American country guitarists.) Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 11:18, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

  • Keep – has the nom not looked at the category in question? It contains a host of subcats, including one for singers, as one would expect. A singer is a musician and so is a guitarist. (And what became of the cluebats, who used to accompany Ten Pound Hammer?) Oculi (talk) 11:42, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Keep. For the reasons explained by Oculi, the nomination is blatant nonsense. The subcategories include sub-genres of country music, and country musicians who play instruments other than their vocal cords.
    I hope that nominator will withdraw it. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 12:28, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

:*Then why not pare to only the subcategories? It seems redundant for a singer to be categorized as both "singer" and "musician" if their only instrument is the voice. And it's not like there are any musicians known for playing and instrument that a.) is not the voice and b.) doesn't already have its own category. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 13:13, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::*That's routine category maintenance, which should happen as a matter of course. A lack of diffusion is not grounds for deleting a container category.
If you think there is a backlog of diffusion, then the good news is that you got the job :) --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:17, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

:::*It's also an assload of work. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 13:30, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::::*Sure. You don't have to volunteer to do it. But if you don't wanna fix it, please don't WP:DEMOLISH it. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 15:14, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::::* It's also part of :Category:Country musicians by nationality. I agree that most of the articles should not be at the top level, as in the other nationality subcats. (And weren't there otters as well? Hammer, otters, cluebats? [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Spell4yr&diff=prev&oldid=222757509 Clamshells]??) Oculi (talk) 15:25, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

:Keep This looks like a mission for WP:SOFIXIT. Benkenobi18 (talk) 19:11, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

==Canadian region categories==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: keep. except rename :Category:Region of Waterloo, Ontario to :Category:Waterloo Region. I've combined these because they all amount to the same discussion.--Mike Selinker (talk) 14:57, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

=== Regional Municipality of Waterloo categories ===

  • Nominator's rationale: Rename all. per convention to follow the Regional Municipality of Waterloo main article by using C2D. On the past speedy nominations. Most of the Ontario census divisions in categories was speedy renamed to follow the main article. There is no objection in the past speedy nominations. But recently three of the group categories in three census divisions in Ontario was oppose speedy. Forget about how many hits or views on the old categories this is to rename the categories to follow the main article on C2D with no objection since the speedy was opposed. Steam5 (talk) 03:19, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. I spotted this at WP:CFD/S, and the proposed new name seemed unnecessarily verbose, so I did a quick google search and found [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Regional+Municipality+of+Waterloo%22+-wikipedia 110,000 ghits for "Regional Municipality of Waterloo"] but [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Waterloo%20Region%22+-wikipedia 4,270,000 ghits for "Waterloo Region"]. That prompted my objection.
    However, per WP:COMMONNAME, it is preferable to search Google News and Google Books because they concentrate reliable sources. The results for Google News are [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Regional+Municipality+of+Waterloo%22&tbm=nws 10 hits for "Regional Municipality of Waterloo"] and [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Waterloo%20Region%22&tbm=nws 12,000 hits for "Waterloo Region"]. Faced with this overwhelming preference for the short form in common usage, naming policy is to use the common name. Some related categories and articles may also need to be renamed to the short format. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 09:32, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::In my past speedy nominations, Most of the speedy nominations for the Ontario census division categories was speedy renamed to match and follow the main article by using C2D with no objection in the past. Steam5 (talk) 18:28, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

:::It may well be that those moves should have been challenged too. If these nominations are closed as "keep", I'll see whether any of the other should be nominated for moving back to the short names. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:13, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::::No users are participating the discuss the three census division categories, BHG. Let's extended this discussion for another week until users have reached a consensus. Steam5 (talk) 07:13, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:The Canadian Wikipedians' notice board has been [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Canadian_Wikipedians%27_notice_board&diff=prev&oldid=516026979 notified]. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:27, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

:Oppose The nominator is correct that the categories absolutely should match the article title, but in this case there is significant doubt that the article itself is properly named. While "Regional Municipality of X" is the legal and official name for regional upper tier municipalities in Ontario, the most common name is almost always "X Region" (and, in fact, the regional governments themselves, IIRC, use the shortened versions of their names). This, and the related, category renaming discussions should be held in abeyance, and the affected articles should all be made subject to one RM. The ultimate decision here would depend on how the RM for the articles goes. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 20:49, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

=== Regional Municipality of Durham categories ===

  • Nominator's rationale: Rename all. per convention to follow the Regional Municipality of Durham main article by using C2D. On the past speedy nominations. Most of the Ontario census divisions in categories was speedy renamed to follow the main article. There is no objection in the past speedy nominations. But recently three of the group categories in three census divisions in Ontario was oppose speedy. Forget about how many hits or views on the old categories this is to rename the categories to follow the main article on C2D with no objection since the speedy was opposed. Steam5 (talk) 03:05, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. I spotted this at WP:CFD/S, and the proposed new name seemed unnecessarily verbose, so I did a quick google search and found [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Regional+Municipality+of+Durham%22+-wikipedia 79,000 ghits for "Regional Municipality of Durham"] but [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Durham%20Region%22+-wikipedia 38 million ghits for "Durham Region"]. That prompted my objection.
    However, per WP:COMMONNAME, it is preferable to search Google News and Google Books because they concentrate reliable sources. The results for Google News are [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Regional+Municipality+of+Durham%22&tbm=nws 5 hits for "Regional Municipality of Durham"] and [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Durham%20Region%22&tbm=nws 1,360 hits for "Durham Region"]. Faced with this overwhelming preference for the short form in common usage, naming policy is to use the common name. Some related categories and articles may also need to be renamed to the short format. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 09:35, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::In my past speedy nominations, Most of the speedy nominations for the Ontario census division categories was speedy renamed to match and follow the main article by using C2D with no objection in the past. Steam5 (talk) 18:29, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

:::It may well be that those moves should have been challenged too. If these nominations are closed as "keep", I'll see whether any of the other should be nominated for moving back to the short names. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:13, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::::No users are participating the discuss the three census division categories, BHG. Let's extended this discussion for another week until users have reached a consensus. Steam5 (talk) 07:12, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:The Canadian Wikipedians' notice board has been [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Canadian_Wikipedians%27_notice_board&diff=prev&oldid=516026979 notified]. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:27, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

  • Oppose, for the same reasons as I explained at the same discussion for the Region of Waterloo categories. Perhaps we could centralize the discussion there, so we don't all need to post the same comments in three separate discussions dealing with the same issue. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 20:51, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Oppose per commonname rules.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:45, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

=== Regional Municipality of York categories ===

  • Nominator's rationale: Rename all. per convention to follow the Regional Municipality of York main article by using C2D. On the past speedy nominations. Most of the Ontario census divisions in categories was speedy renamed to follow the main article. There is no objection in the past speedy nominations. But recently three of the group categories in three census divisions in Ontario was oppose speedy. Forget about how many hits or views on the old categories this is to rename the categories to follow the main article on C2D with no objection since the speedy was opposed. Steam5 (talk) 02:45, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. I spotted this at WP:CFD/S, and the proposed new name seemed unnecessarily verbose, so I did a quick google search and found [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Regional+Municipality+of+York%22+-wikipedia 169,000 ghits for "Regional Municipality of York"] but [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22York%20Region%22+-wikipedia 35 million ghits for "York Region"]. That prompted my objection.
    However, per WP:COMMONNAME, it is preferable to search Google News and Google Books because they concentrate reliable sources. The results for Google News are [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Regional+Municipality+of+York%22&tbm=nws 4 hits for "Regional Municipality of York"] and [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22York%20Region%22&tbm=nws 3,740 hits for "York Region"].I considered the possibility that "York Region" might also be misused to refer to another York on an island near France, so I repeated the Gnews search by adding the keyword Ontario. That gave [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22Regional+Municipality+of+York%22+Ontario&tbm=nws 3 hits for "Regional Municipality of York"] and [https://www.google.ca/search?q=%22York%20Region%22+Ontario&tbm=nws 641 hits for "York Region"].
    Faced with this overwhelming preference for the short form in common usage, naming policy is to use the common name. Some related categories and articles may also need to be renamed to the short format. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 09:42, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::In my past speedy nominations, Most of the speedy nominations for the Ontario census division categories was speedy renamed to match and follow the main article by using C2D with no objection in the past. Steam5 (talk) 18:29, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

:::It may well be that those moves should have been challenged too. If these nominations are closed as "keep", I'll see whether any of the other should be nominated for moving back to the short names. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:13, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

::::No users are participating the discuss the three census division categories, BHG. Let's extended this discussion for another week until users have reached a consensus. Steam5 (talk) 07:12, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:The Canadian Wikipedians' notice board has been [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Canadian_Wikipedians%27_notice_board&diff=prev&oldid=516026979 notified]. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:28, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

  • Oppose, for the same reasons as I explained at the same discussion for the Region of Waterloo categories. Perhaps we could centralize the discussion there, so we don't all need to post the same comments in three separate discussions dealing with the same issue. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 20:52, 4 October 2012 (UTC)
  • Oppose per commonname rules.John Pack Lambert (talk) 03:01, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.