Talk:Malaysia–Vietnam relations

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{{Talk:Malaysia–Vietnam relations/GA1}}

{{Talk:Malaysia–Vietnam relations/GA2}}

Dai Viet's ambush of Malay envoys to China.

http://epress.nus.edu.sg/msl/entry/1981

http://epress.nus.edu.sg/msl/entry/2657

Cham–Vietnamese War (1471)

http://www.ari.nus.edu.sg/docs/wps/wps03_011.pdf

http://www.aafv.org/spip.php?action=acceder_document&arg=2559&cle=a72c793f4c842206ab899315a3419d33a4609888&file=pdf%2FSunLaichen_ChineseStyleFirearmsInDaiViet.pdf

http://www.jstor.org/stable/20072535?

Military Technology Transfers from Ming China and the Emergence of Northern Mainland Southeast Asia (c. 1390-1527)

Sun Laichen

Journal of Southeast Asian Studies

Vol. 34, No. 3 (Oct., 2003), pp. 495-517

Published by: Cambridge University Press on behalf of Department of History, National University of Singapore

Stable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/20072535

Page Count: 23

http://books.google.com/books?id=ZvWrAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA75#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=R5p7cRyK748C&pg=PA111&dq=1480,+according+to+Chinese+spies,+Dai+Viet+forces+took+20+of+Lan+Xang's+strong-+points+and+killed+“over+20,000”+Lao.+...+Tra+Toan+was+captured,+Laos+collapsed,+Ryukyu+was+defeated+.+.+.+the+barbarians+in+the+four+directions+surrendered,+.+.+.+the+...&hl=en&sa=X&ei=jaY3U5buJompsQSo-oHYDw&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=1480%2C%20according%20to%20Chinese%20spies%2C%20Dai%20Viet%20forces%20took%2020%20of%20Lan%20Xang's%20strong-%20points%20and%20killed%20“over%2020%2C000”%20Lao.%20...%20Tra%20Toan%20was%20captured%2C%20Laos%20collapsed%2C%20Ryukyu%20was%20defeated%20.%20.%20.%20the%20barbarians%20in%20the%20four%20directions%20surrendered%2C%20.%20.%20.%20the%20...&f=false

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&tbo=1&q=collapsed%2C+Ryukyu+was+defeated%2C+Cam+Cong+fled+and+died%2C+the+barbarians+in+the+four+directions+surrendered%2C+wind+blew+from+the+eight+directions.+%5BDuring+his%5D+thirty+-eight-year+rule%2C+the+country+was+peaceful+and+well+governed.+How+spectacular+...&btnG=#q=However%2C+this+so+far+is+not+substantiated+by+other+sources+and+the+records+on+the+Ryukyu+side%2C+as+the+Rekidai+hoan+(the+precious+records+of+the+consecutive+dynasties)%2C+are&tbm=bks

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA104&dq=However,+this+so+far+is+not+substantiated+by+other+sources+and+the+records+on+the+Ryukyu+side,+as+the+Rekidai+hoan+(the+precious+records+of+the+consecutive+dynasties),+are&hl=en&sa=X&ei=QdZKU_bTNvKssASljoHYCg&ved=0CCkQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=However%2C%20this%20so%20far%20is%20not%20substantiated%20by%20other%20sources%20and%20the%20records%20on%20the%20Ryukyu%20side%2C%20as%20the%20Rekidai%20hoan%20(the%20precious%20records%20of%20the%20consecutive%20dynasties)%2C%20are&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA105&dq=collapsed,+Ryukyu+was+defeated,+Cam+Cong+fled+and+died,+the+barbarians+in+the+four+directions+surrendered,+wind+blew+from+the+eight+directions.&hl=en&sa=X&ei=G6Y3U7DhAo3NsQS8hYLADA&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=collapsed%2C%20Ryukyu%20was%20defeated%2C%20Cam%20Cong%20fled%20and%20died%2C%20the%20barbarians%20in%20the%20four%20directions%20surrendered%2C%20wind%20blew%20from%20the%20eight%20directions.&f=false

Title Ming-Southeast Asian overland interactions, 1368-1644

Author Laichen Sun

Publisher University of Michigan, 2000

266

http://books.google.com/books?id=o4QfAQAAMAAJ&q=However,+this+so+far+is+not+substantiated+by+other+sources+and+the+records+on+the+Ryukyu+side,+as+the+Rekidai+hoan+(the+precious+records+of+the+consecutive+dynasties),+are&dq=However,+this+so+far+is+not+substantiated+by+other+sources+and+the+records+on+the+Ryukyu+side,+as+the+Rekidai+hoan+(the+precious+records+of+the+consecutive+dynasties),+are&hl=en&sa=X&ei=QdZKU_bTNvKssASljoHYCg&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAQ

http://books.google.com/books?id=o4QfAQAAMAAJ&q=In+1485,+Dai+Viet+included+Malacca+on+the+list+of+tributary+countries+such+as+Champa,+Lang+Sang,+Ayudhya,+and+Java.1221+According+to+a+Vietnamese+source,+Dai+Viet+during+the+late+Hong-duc+reign+(1470-97)+also+subdued+Ryukyu+(+Liuqiu).&dq=In+1485,+Dai+Viet+included+Malacca+on+the+list+of+tributary+countries+such+as+Champa,+Lang+Sang,+Ayudhya,+and+Java.1221+According+to+a+Vietnamese+source,+Dai+Viet+during+the+late+Hong-duc+reign+(1470-97)+also+subdued+Ryukyu+(+Liuqiu).&hl=en&sa=X&ei=M6c3U9ewKeLQsQSL7IGoBg&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA

http://books.google.com/books?id=o4QfAQAAMAAJ&q=The+details+of+Dai+Viet's+attempted+aggression+are+not+available,+but+it+seems+that+Malacca+was+directly+threatened+in+...+expanded+the+territories;+Tra+Toan+was+captured,+Laos+collapsed,+Ryukyu+was+defeated,+Cam+Cong+fled+and+died,+the&dq=The+details+of+Dai+Viet's+attempted+aggression+are+not+available,+but+it+seems+that+Malacca+was+directly+threatened+in+...+expanded+the+territories;+Tra+Toan+was+captured,+Laos+collapsed,+Ryukyu+was+defeated,+Cam+Cong+fled+and+died,+the&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kKU3U7tck6-wBKa0gZAG&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA

http://books.google.com/books?id=o4QfAQAAMAAJ&q=According+to+Mao+Qiling+(hezhi+Mansi,+vol.+10,+p.+Lb),+Le+Thanh-tong+led+90,000+troops+to+invade+Lan+Sang+but+were+chased+by+%5Bthe+troops+of%5D+Malacca,+and+30,000+soldiers+died.+It+is+hard+to+explain+how+this+happened&dq=According+to+Mao+Qiling+(hezhi+Mansi,+vol.+10,+p.+Lb),+Le+Thanh-tong+led+90,000+troops+to+invade+Lan+Sang+but+were+chased+by+%5Bthe+troops+of%5D+Malacca,+and+30,000+soldiers+died.+It+is+hard+to+explain+how+this+happened&hl=en&sa=X&ei=g6Q3U7m0DKGosATh8oCgBQ&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA

http://books.google.com/books?id=o4QfAQAAMAAJ&q=However,+this+so+far+is+not+substantiated+by+other+sources+and+the+records+on+the+Ryukyu+side,+as+the+Rekidai+hoan+(the+precious+records+of+the+consecutive+dynasties),+are&dq=However,+this+so+far+is+not+substantiated+by+other+sources+and+the+records+on+the+Ryukyu+side,+as+the+Rekidai+hoan+(the+precious+records+of+the+consecutive+dynasties),+are&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RKY3U820O5SmsQSV4oCwAQ&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAQ

107

http://books.google.com/books?id=FNGGAAAAIAAJ&q=Though+Marrison+translated+Rakiu+as+Formosa,+it+should+be+understood+as+Ryukyu+kingdom,+and+it+is+likely+that+the+relations+...+Ceramics+and+silk+Confronted+with+Malacca+and+Ryukyu,+both+of+which+took+sides+with+Champa,+Dai-Viet+may+have+...&dq=Though+Marrison+translated+Rakiu+as+Formosa,+it+should+be+understood+as+Ryukyu+kingdom,+and+it+is+likely+that+the+relations+...+Ceramics+and+silk+Confronted+with+Malacca+and+Ryukyu,+both+of+which+took+sides+with+Champa,+Dai-Viet+may+have+...&hl=en&sa=X&ei=6KY3U4DMLsTLsQSr4YCQBQ&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA

http://books.google.com/books?id=fjsEn3w4TPgC&pg=PA365&dq=1999.+“A+Short+Introduction+to+Champa+Studies.”+In+The+Dry+Areas+in+Southeast+Asia,+Fukui+Hayao,+65—74.+Kyoto:+Center+for+Southeast+Asian+Studies,+Kyoto+University.+.+2008.+“Was+Dai+Viet+a+Rival+of+Ryukyu.”+In+China+and+Southeast+Asia,+ed.&hl=en&sa=X&ei=tqY3U_nwM-q2sASk64DwAQ&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=1999.%20“A%20Short%20Introduction%20to%20Champa%20Studies.”%20In%20The%20Dry%20Areas%20in%20Southeast%20Asia%2C%20Fukui%20Hayao%2C%2065—74.%20Kyoto%3A%20Center%20for%20Southeast%20Asian%20Studies%2C%20Kyoto%20University.%20.%202008.%20“Was%20Dai%20Viet%20a%20Rival%20of%20Ryukyu.”%20In%20China%20and%20Southeast%20Asia%2C%20ed.&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=-01JisWpJbEC&pg=PA383&dq=115+Momoki+Shiro,+“Was+Dai+Viet+a+Rival+of+Ryukyu+within+the+Tributary+Trade+System+of+the+Ming+during+the+Early+Le+Period?”+(ms).+On+Dai+Viet's+foreign+trade+and+bullion+flows+in+this+period,+see+too+Sakurai,+“Age+of+Commerce,”+2;+Abu+Ridho,+...&hl=en&sa=X&ei=-6Y3U4_YNLe1sASjo4D4Dg&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=115%20Momoki%20Shiro%2C%20“Was%20Dai%20Viet%20a%20Rival%20of%20Ryukyu%20within%20the%20Tributary%20Trade%20System%20of%20the%20Ming%20during%20the%20Early%20Le%20Period%3F”%20(ms).%20On%20Dai%20Viet's%20foreign%20trade%20and%20bullion%20flows%20in%20this%20period%2C%20see%20too%20Sakurai%2C%20“Age%20of%20Commerce%2C”%202%3B%20Abu%20Ridho%2C%20...&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=ggyl2FSzXvgC&pg=PA13&dq=Third,+new+market+opportunities+opened+up+in+Japan,+possibly+in+connection+with+the+Ryukyu+network,+and+also+in+...+See,+for+example,+Shiro+Momoki,+%22Was+Dai-+Viet+a+Rival+of+Ryukyu+within+the+Tributary+Trade+System+of+the+Ming+during+the+...&hl=en&sa=X&ei=Fqc3U9WAE8zKsQTWwYLQAg&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Third%2C%20new%20market%20opportunities%20opened%20up%20in%20Japan%2C%20possibly%20in%20connection%20with%20the%20Ryukyu%20network%2C%20and%20also%20in%20...%20See%2C%20for%20example%2C%20Shiro%20Momoki%2C%20%22Was%20Dai-%20Viet%20a%20Rival%20of%20Ryukyu%20within%20the%20Tributary%20Trade%20System%20of%20the%20Ming%20during%20the%20...&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=aSEJqSQS7wkC&pg=PA172&dq=The+Ryukyu+Islands,+it+is+well-known,+were+connected+to+various+ports+in+Southeast+Asia.+Therefore,+pepper,+sappanwood+and+...+%22Was+Dai+Viet+during+the+Early+Le+Period+(1428-1527)+a+Rival+of+Ryukyu?%22+-+On+the+maritime+horse+trade,+see+R.+P.+...&hl=en&sa=X&ei=Kac3U4SjKavnsAT6koKIAg&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=The%20Ryukyu%20Islands%2C%20it%20is%20well-known%2C%20were%20connected%20to%20various%20ports%20in%20Southeast%20Asia.%20Therefore%2C%20pepper%2C%20sappanwood%20and%20...%20%22Was%20Dai%20Viet%20during%20the%20Early%20Le%20Period%20(1428-1527)%20a%20Rival%20of%20Ryukyu%3F%22%20-%20On%20the%20maritime%20horse%20trade%2C%20see%20R.%20P.%20...&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=52kfAQAAIAAJ&q=The+Ryukyu+Islands,+it+is+well-known,+were+connected+to+various+ports+in+Southeast+Asia.+Therefore,+pepper,+sappanwood+and+...+%22Was+Dai+Viet+during+the+Early+Le+Period+(1428-1527)+a+Rival+of+Ryukyu?%22+-+On+the+maritime+horse+trade,+see+R.+P.+...&dq=The+Ryukyu+Islands,+it+is+well-known,+were+connected+to+various+ports+in+Southeast+Asia.+Therefore,+pepper,+sappanwood+and+...+%22Was+Dai+Viet+during+the+Early+Le+Period+(1428-1527)+a+Rival+of+Ryukyu?%22+-+On+the+maritime+horse+trade,+see+R.+P.+...&hl=en&sa=X&ei=Kac3U4SjKavnsAT6koKIAg&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAQ

http://books.google.com/books?id=05x5UGA8MmAC&pg=PA59&dq=ryukyu+dai+viet&hl=en&sa=X&ei=-6M3U92gA-vKsQShxILAAQ&ved=0CEkQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=ryukyu%20dai%20viet&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA104#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA105#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA103#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA119#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA110#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=TgkYAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA252#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA104#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=R5p7cRyK748C&pg=PA111#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=R5p7cRyK748C&pg=PA110#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=Bc30ytJmwzMC&pg=PA110#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=R5p7cRyK748C&pg=PA108#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=tzh1fQEEFPAC&pg=PA101&dq=champa+gunpowder&hl=en&sa=X&ei=sNVKU5bAIOGgsQS9v4DIBw&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=champa%20gunpowder&f=false

w:vi:Chiến tranh Đại Việt - Lan Xang (1478-1480)

w:vi:Chiến tranh Đại Việt-Chiêm Thành (1471)

Les Kosem

http://www.champaka.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=777:viengtham&catid=80:2012&Itemid=92

http://www.champaka.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=911:tiens&catid=34:lichsu&Itemid=28

Katip Suma's Jihad against Emperor Minh Mang's invasion of Champa in 1832-1835

http://www.chamtoday.com/index.php/history-l-ch-s/78-the-uprisings-of-katip-sumat-and-ja-thak-wa-1833-1835

http://www.chamtoday.com/index.php/history-l-ch-s/83-the-uprising-of-jathak-wa-1834-1835

http://books.google.com/books?id=3oMqrqSp1W4C&pg=PA25#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://chamunesco.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=110:the-raja-praong-ritual-a-memory-of-the-sea-in-cham-malay-relations&catid=45:van-hoa&Itemid=120

{{quote|Meanwhile, lack document to record the yourneys of Malay came to Champa by sea. Execpt, the yourney of Tuen Phaow from Kelantan come to Champa by sea to lead a Jihad movement to expel theVietnamese army from the land of Champa}}

http://voa-islam.com//news/world-world/2009/07/01/96/history-of-islam-in-vietnam/;

http://voa-islam.com/news/world-world/2009/07/01/96/history-of-islam-in-vietnam/;

http://m.voa-islam.com/news/world-world/2009/07/01/96/history-of-islam-in-vietnam/;

http://www.angelfire.com/vt/vietnamesemuslims/hstry.html

http://books.google.com/books?id=Zw0j_5OauH8C&pg=PT180#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://www.chamtoday.com/index.php/news-tin-t-c/world-th-gi-i/120-the-champa-history-book-debut-and-a-seminar-on-the-indiginous-people-of-champa

http://kyotoreview.cseas.kyoto-u.ac.jp/issue/issue4/article_353.html

http://kyotoreview.org/issue-5/vietnam-champa-relations-and-the-malay-islam-regional-network-in-the-17th-19th-centuries/

Rajmaan (talk) 03:19, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

Hi, I have removed the following paragraph:

"The Cham Muslim leader Katip Suma was educated in Kelantan and came back to Champa to declare a Jihad against the Vietnamese after Emperor Minh Mang's annexation of Champa.{{cite book|author=Jean-François Hubert|title=The Art of Champa|url=http://books.google.com/books?id=3oMqrqSp1W4C&pg=PA25|date=8 May 2012|publisher=Parkstone International|isbn=978-1-78042-964-9|pages=25–}}{{cite web|title=The Raja Praong Ritual: A Memory of the Sea in Cham- Malay Relations|url=https://web.archive.org/web/20150206042152/http://chamunesco.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=110:the-raja-praong-ritual-a-memory-of-the-sea-in-cham-malay-relations&catid=45:van-hoa&Itemid=120|website=Cham Unesco|accessdate=25 June 2015}} (Extracted from Truong Van Mon, “The Raja Praong Ritual: a Memory of the sea in Cham- Malay Relations”, in Memory And Knowledge Of The Sea In South Asia, Institute of Ocean and Earth Sciences, University of Malaya, Monograph Sries 3, pp, 97-111. International Seminar on Martime Culture and Geopolitics & Workshop on Bajau Laut Music and Dance”, Institute of Ocean and Earth Sciences and the Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences, University of Malaya, 23-24/2008) {{cite web|last1=Dharma|first1=Po|title=The Uprisings of Katip Sumat and Ja Thak Wa (1833-1835)|url=http://www.chamtoday.com/index.php/history-l-ch-s/78-the-uprisings-of-katip-sumat-and-ja-thak-wa-1833-1835|website=Cham Today|accessdate=25 June 2015}}"

{{reflist}}

I think this point seems to be more of a fringe event concerning Malaysia-Vietnam relations and would be more appropriate for the Champa article. If it should be insisted that this should be included in the main text, I strongly advise more elaboration, as four sources are cited. Otherwise it really affects the overall quality of the prose as per Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Layout#Paragraphs and Wikipedia:Verifiability#Verifiability_does_not_guarantee_inclusion.

I do also think that for just one sentence, choose the most reliable one, at the most two sources. Four sources really constitutes Wikipedia:Citation overkill. If the editor strongly feels about reintroducing this content into the text, I hope the above concerns maybe addressed, otherwise it might not pass the GA review. Mr Tan (talk) 18:34, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

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