Talk:White genocide conspiracy theory#Very strong language, few sources
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Is white genocide a myth?
:There are no reliable sources suggesting that the conspiracy theory is not a political myth. There are many reliable sources indicating that it is, such as:
:*"The Myth of White Genocide" [https://harpers.org/archive/2019/03/the-myth-of-white-genocide-in-south-africa/ Harper's,] March 2019
:*"White genocide: A dangerous myth employed by racists" [https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/white-genocide-a-dangerous-myth-employed-by-racists-1.3981739 The Irish Times,] August 2019
:*"The Hate Report: The story behind Trump’s South Africa tweet" [https://www.revealnews.org/blog/the-hate-report-the-story-behind-trumps-south-africa-tweet/ Reveal,] August 2018
:*"The South Africans pushing the 'white genocide' myth" [https://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2018/11/16/white-genocide-in-south-africa-cnn-lon-orig.cnn CNN,] November 2018
:*"The dangerous myth of 'white genocide'" [https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2018/08/23/dangerous-myth-white-genocide-south-africa SPLC,] August 2018
:*"Facebook allowed advertisers to target users interested in “'white genocide" — even in wake of Pittsburgh massacre" [https://theintercept.com/2018/11/02/facebook-ads-white-supremacy-pittsburgh-shooting/ The Intercept,] November 2018
:*"The deadly myth of 'White Genocide'" [https://www.abc.net.au/religion/the-deadly-myth-of-white-genocide/10917562 Australian Broadcasting Corporation,] March 2019
Are white farmers being targeted in South Africa?
:While many farmers in South Africa have been targeted in attacks against landowners, there is no evidence that the attackers are targeting people because they are white. This topic is covered in some of the references above and at South African farm attacks.
Why doesn't this article include extrapolations of human genetic phenotype expression into the future?
:Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. There is no way to validate the accuracy of any such predictions, and those predictions which show a wide demographic shift are based on assumptions which are both uncertain, and likely to substantially change the outcome of the extrapolations if they are wrong. There are at least as many factors at play as expressed alleles in the human genome, leading to confidence intervals much wider than the range of predictions.
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Semi-protected edit request on 2 April 2025
{{edit semi-protected|White genocide conspiracy theory|answered=yes}}
I request for where it says "South African government is now seizing land from white farmers" to be changed to "South African government is now seizing land from white farmers" since not all White South Africans are Afrikaners. 2A0A:EF40:1395:D501:E858:FE42:3024:692C (talk) 21:39, 2 April 2025 (UTC)
:Aren't the farmers primary Afrikaners, who seem to be what the Intelligencer source is referring to when it refers to white farmers? 1101 (talk) 15:20, 3 April 2025 (UTC)
:File:X mark.svg Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Tlx|Edit semi-protected}} template. Grayfell (talk) 22:37, 17 April 2025 (UTC)
"Julius Malema MP reacted, saying "there is no white genocide in South Africa"
Is this a joke? Why quote someone who actually openly calls for white genocide. Of course he is going to claim that. Why is his quote used as a definitive source? Here is one example: "Shoot to kill! Kill the Boer! The farmer! - Julius Malema". Is this not a call for genocide?
https://x.com/EndWokeness/status/1754905357267177692
https://x.com/DrewPavlou/status/1888648137339813941
Performing to a 100k strong crowd: “Shoot to kIll, kIll the boer, the farmer, prrr phaa, prrr phaa”
https://x.com/twatterbaas/status/1764284927246217332
Maybe we should include this quote from Malema: “These people, when you want to hit them hard, go after a white man. They feel terrible pain because you have touched a white man. We're cutting the throat of whiteness. We will kill white women, children, and their pets.”
Here, he is saying that on camera:
https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1888589439334584813
Elon Musk: "This is a major political party in the South African parliament and their leader is calling for genocide of white people"
So can we add a quote from Elon Musk? Or we can only quote Malema who claims "there is no white genocide in SA"? Zp112 (talk) 22:04, 17 April 2025 (UTC)
:The source for Malema's quote is the Guardian, which is a generally reliable outlet:
:*{{cite news|date=23 August 2018|title=Donald Trump's land seizures tweet draws angry reaction in South Africa|work=The Guardian|url=https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/aug/23/trump-orders-close-study-of-south-africa-farmer-killings|access-date=23 August 2018|archive-date=14 January 2021|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20210114222821/https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/aug/23/trump-orders-close-study-of-south-africa-farmer-killings|url-status=live}}
:If you know of a reliable source for this, propose it for discussion. WP:CONTEXTMATTERS. Decontextualized retweets originating from conspiracy theorists are very, very unlikely to be reliable sources. Grayfell (talk) 22:32, 17 April 2025 (UTC)
::"The source for Malema's quote is the Guardian" -- so technically you are correct. But do you see the irony here? That is the same Malema who also literally calls for the genocide in his speeches but because he denies that and his denial was quoted by the Guardian which is considered a "reliable source" we have to conclude that Malema's statement is true despite the evidence of the opposite -- regular calls for violence in his speeches. But because his speeches and calls for violence against whites are not covered by "reliable sources", this info is not reliable and cannot be included in the article even though there are tons of videos of him saying that but somehow what you can see with your own eyes is not a reliable source! Zp112 (talk) 21:39, 18 April 2025 (UTC)
:::There's nothing 'ironic' about this. If you have a reliable source, share it. Grayfell (talk) 22:43, 18 April 2025 (UTC)
:"So can we add a quote from Elon Musk?" Since when is Elon Musk and his propaganda reliable sources? Where is Musk's reputation for fact-checking? Dimadick (talk) 22:39, 17 April 2025 (UTC)
::But quoting Malema is fine? That's a reliable source, right? Zp112 (talk) 21:28, 18 April 2025 (UTC)
:::If a reliable source says he said it, then we can say he said it, if it is also WP:DUE. But is it due? I don't see how angry words from the leader of a party with 10% of the National Assembly amounts to genocide. O3000, Ret. (talk) 22:09, 18 April 2025 (UTC)
::::Oh great, "it is only 10%, it is nothing". I understand the video right from the horse's mouth is not a "reliable source". But if he is so irrelevant, why does this article quote him as proof that there is nothing to worry about and "it is just a conspiracy theory, bro"? The editors could have picked some other politician who, at the very least, doesn't openly call for something he denies. Zp112 (talk) 03:36, 19 April 2025 (UTC)
:::::You can't use THE source. You have to use a reliable source that is referencing THE source. Whoever controls the media, controls the mind. 101.173.21.8 (talk) 00:49, 16 May 2025 (UTC)
:::::If wikipedia had existed in the 1940s, we would see this argument about The Holocaust. "Well it's only these people who said it happened and they're not reliable sources because we said they aren't. It's clearly propaganda because we dislike the people who said it." 2601:19A:4400:1DB0:710C:4BB2:526B:7820 (talk) 03:08, 16 May 2025 (UTC)
- I am unable to find any actual white genocide in SA in any reliable sources. The Guardian article is more informative if fully digested. O3000, Ret. (talk) 00:18, 18 April 2025 (UTC)
Elon Musk’s racist misrepresentation of Witkruis
This topic is in the news now owing to disinformation by Elon Musk, who has falsely stated that the Witkruis Monument is a graveyard for murdered white farmers. Musk’s lie is now being repeated by gullible Americans and racist propagandists. See: https://www.msn.com/en-za/news/other/so-many-crosses-elon-musk-reacts-to-clip-of-farmers-memorial-site-witkruis-monument-sa-divides/ar-AA1ELe9C 105.247.232.34 154.66.194.115 (talk) 22:57, 14 May 2025 (UTC)
:There is evidence that Musk is now using his Grok AI to promote the white genocide conspiracy theory. https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2025/05/elon-musk-grok-white-genocide/682817/ 174.208.228.114 (talk) 18:39, 16 May 2025 (UTC)