Template:Did you know nominations/William V. Thompson

{{DYK nompage links|nompage=William V. Thompson|William V. Thompson}}

• ... that William V. Thompson did not want to be called Father of Bowling, so was titled "Dean of the Bowling World" instead for his efforts to get the new game of ten-pin bowling to regulation standards?
• Comment: Source for original hook is #14 newspaper article "Dean of Bowling now a New Yorker" William V. Thompson famed throughout the West as the Dean of the Bowling World...

:* Reviewed: Peters's squirrel

:* Comment: QPQ is the 7th article of Peters's squirrel

Created by Doug Coldwell (talk) and Jsayre64 (talk). Nominated by Doug Coldwell (talk) at 11:43, 24 November 2016 (UTC).

:* 16px Article is new, long enough, has no outstanding policy issues. Hook, while interesting, is a bit long (hitting, but not surpassing, the 200-character limit) and sourced offline, but will take both in good faith. QPQ is valid. SounderBruce 02:43, 29 November 2016 (UTC)

• Not really sure of the process, but per comments at WT:DYK and WP:ERRORS, there are issues with the hook that make it unsuitable for the main page, and time was getting short before it was going to appear on the main page, so I pulled it from Queue 2. The comments about the hook are [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Main_Page/Errors&oldid=757125738 here] and [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Did_you_know&oldid=757126366#Queue_2 here]. I assume I can just open this subpage back up and interested people can wordsmith the hook and eventaully re-add it to a prep area or a queue or something; if that isn't kosher, I'd ask someone familiar with DYK to do whatever is supposed to be done. --Floquenbeam (talk) 23:22, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

The approved hook in the nomination was

• ... that William V. Thompson did not want to be called Father of Bowling, so was titled "Dean of the Bowling World" instead for his efforts to get the new game of ten-pin bowling to regulation standards?

...somewhere that got reworded. If this approved hook were used and "regulation" changed to "tournament" I believe that would fit the bill. I copy edited the article accordingly. It then would say,

• ALT1a ... that William V. Thompson did not want to be called Father of Bowling, so was titled "Dean of the Bowling World" instead for his efforts to get the new game of ten-pin bowling to tournament standards?

• ALT1b ... that William V. Thompson did not want to be called the "Father of Bowling", so was titled "Dean of Bowling" instead for his efforts to get the new game of ten-pin bowling to tournament standards?

:[https://www.newspapers.com/clip/7260506/the_brooklyn_daily_eagle/ Reference for the hook]

::Would ALT1b work? Withdrew ALT1a to keep it simple.--Doug Coldwell (talk) 23:22, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

• 16px New reviewer needed to check the new hooks against the article and against the issues raised with the previously promoted hook as noted above. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 23:39, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

16px Comments on the main page errors suggested adding "the" and quotes around "Father of Bowling" to agree with the article and source. Please update and I'll check it. Thanks, Zeete (talk) 21:08, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

:{{ping|Zeete}} {{Done}} --Doug Coldwell (talk) 21:22, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

• Close, I think "the" was outside the quotes, and did you mean to drop the comma? Thanks, Zeete (talk) 21:32, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

::{{ping|Zeete}} ooooppppsss (late in the day for an old man) - how is it now?--Doug Coldwell (talk) 21:38, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

16px ALT1b should be good to go. The "Father of Bowling" agrees with the article, and the first suggestion of [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Main_Page/Errors&oldid=757125738 here]. "regulation standards" replaced with clearer "tournament standards". I got a hook length of 197. Zeete (talk) 21:52, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

• Note: as I recall, the main part of the complaint at WP:ERRORS was that "...his efforts to get the new game of ten-pin bowling to regulation standards?" doesn't actually mean anything to normal readers. How is "tournament standards" better? What does "getting a game to tournament standards" even mean? Is this phrase used in the sources? You might want to consider one of the 3-4 suggestions in the WP:ERRORS thread. Right now, I don't see this as much of an improvement over the pulled hook at all; you basically added some quotation marks and switched out one word for another. --Floquenbeam (talk) 22:05, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

:*Fixed the formatting on ALT1b, but that doesn't address any of the issues noted by Floquenbeam, which would indicate that the approved hook is likely to be pulled again as it currently stands. Doug Coldwell, Zeete, I strongly recommend heeding the advice in the above post. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:28, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

• ALT1c ... that William V. Thompson preferred the title "Dean of Bowling" over "Father of Bowling" in recognition of his work promoting and standardizing ten-pin bowling?

:*Proposing above, from suggestion of past thread.--Doug Coldwell (talk) 22:43, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

::{{ping|Zeete}} [https://www.newspapers.com/clip/7260506/the_brooklyn_daily_eagle/ Reference for the hook] --Doug Coldwell (talk) 22:46, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

:16px ALT1c much better. Thanks to all for the updates. Striking 1b. Hook length now 174. But the article has "Dean of Bowling", as does the headline in the source. Could also drop "the" before "Father". Article also needs to change "tournament standards" to agree with the new hook. Thanks, Zeete (talk) 13:38, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

:* Minor copy edit to hook to reflect "Dean of Bowling" and dropped "the" before Father - as suggested. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 14:34, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

::{{ping|Zeete}} - Article changed to "certain standards" to agree with the new hook. Will that work?--Doug Coldwell (talk) 14:41, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

:* Hook has extra "the" in "Dean of Bowling". Article "certain standards" not that clear. I was also looking at the sentence later that has "tournament standards". Thanks, Zeete (talk) 14:59, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

::* {{ping|Zeete}} Removed extra "the" in "Dean of Bowling" in hook. Also copy edited article for clarification.--Doug Coldwell (talk) 15:10, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

• 16px ALT1c should be good to go. {{ping|Floquenbeam}}, {{ping|BlueMoonset}} please confirm. Thanks, Zeete (talk) 15:23, 6 January 2017 (UTC)
• I'm not a DYK reviewer or regular, just someone who patrols WP:ERRORS. I'm not in a position to say whether or not it is "good to go". It does address the concern I noted that was previously brought up at WP:ERRORS: it now makes sense. But I haven't fact checked or anything. One free comment that stands out, though; it used to be "Dean of the Bowling World", now it's just "Dean of Bowling". Is that right? --Floquenbeam (talk) 21:31, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

:::{{ping|Floquenbeam}} "Dean of Bowling" is in the headline of the source and in the article and is shorter! Thanks for your reply, Zeete (talk) 21:39, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

::::OK, thanks, just checking. --Floquenbeam (talk) 21:43, 6 January 2017 (UTC)