Template talk:Infobox comics character#Relatives

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There is a parameter "First appearance" in this template. Shouldn't there also need to be a "last appearance" parameter? I think it is useful to know when the character last appeared in a comic.

I'mFeistyIncognito | Talk 19:10, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

:{{to|I'mfeistyincognito}} thank you for the positive suggestion. This seems to be something that needs the input of other editors who are also involved with this template, so... File:Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{tlx|edit template-protected}} template. Thanks again for your interest in this encyclopedia! P.I. Ellsworth  ed. ^put'r there 19:34, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

::{{re|Paine Ellsworth}}, Thank you for your response. How (and where) should I seek consensus for maximum likelihood of being answered? I'mFeistyIncognito | Talk 20:40, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

:::{{re|I'mfeistyincognito}} I don't know if Paine Ellsworth meant that a formal RfC is required or not (one could be opened right here, and propagate from there), but I'd recommend opening a discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Comics since that WikiProject would be the most frequent user of this template. -2pou (talk) 21:09, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

:::{{to|I'mfeistyincognito|2pou}} whether or not to have an informal discussion or an RfC is up to the editor who wants the new parameter. The WikiProject's talk page would be an excellent place to discuss this and perhaps the best place to garner a consensus for this addition. P.I. Ellsworth  ed. ^put'r there 22:07, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

{{edit template-protected|Template:Infobox comics character|answered=yes}}

There should be an epithets/nicknames section, since comic book characters often have epithets and so people wouldn't add epithets to the aliases section, a mistake I have noticed a lot in character articles

SinkingInMercury (talk) 03:20, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

:File:Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{tlx|edit template-protected}} template. DonIago (talk) 03:49, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

{{atop

| status =

| result = This discussion resulted in {{strong|no consensus}}. In terms of the raw headcount, after discounting a comment from a sock account, there were slightly more editors in favor of the proposal. Other than vague design guidance at WP:INFOBOX, I don't believe there are policies or guidelines that specifically address what makes a good or bad infobox parameter, so I did not expect more than a statement of preference with some reasonable rationale. On the whole, the oppose !voters gave more detailed rationales. {{pb}}Based on the objections, it's likely that a new proposal would be more successful if it includes draft documentation – potentially to include a citation requirement, restriction to epithets present in the works themselves, and some limit on the number of epithets to be included. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 02:59, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

}}

Should there be an epithets parameter in the infobox?

I think there should be, since most comic book characters have epithets, and also to prevent people from mistaking epithets for aliases and putting them in the aliases section, a mistake I have seen frequently in character articles. Any thoughts?

SinkingInMercury (talk) 00:42, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

Edit: Restarted the RfC
SinkingInMercury (talk) 10:57, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

:I'd like to see diffs of these frequent errors before adding additional fictional information to infoboxes, which are common points for bloated minutia. Argento Surfer (talk) 12:19, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

::{{reply|Argento Surfer}}
Batman:
{{diff|Batman|910879205|910531505|+ Dark Knight, The World's Greatest Detective, Caped Crusader}}
{{diff|Batman|986968594|986968446|+ Darknight Detective}}
Two-Face:
{{diff|Two-Face|66625067|66518092|+ Gotham's Protector}}
{{diff|Two-Face|288367615|288186283|+ Apollo}}
{{diff|Two-Face|994966689|994806656|+ Gotham's White Knight}}
Harley Quinn:
{{diff|Harley Quinn|939968755|939968314|+ The Cupid of Crime, The Maid of Mischief}}
{{diff|Harley Quinn|1007265212|1007207909|+ The Mistress of Mayhem, The Clown Princess of Crime}}
Superman:
{{diff|Superman|903114870|902971266|+ The Man of Tomorrow}}
{{diff|Superman|939860006|939839489|+ The Man of Steel, The Last Son of Krypton}}
Green Arrow:
{{diff|Green Arrow|40628923|40034088|+ Emerald Archer, Battling Bowman}}
Wonder Woman:
{{diff|Wonder Woman|1026186320|1025942710|+ Goddess of Truth}}
SinkingInMercury (talk) 14:24, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

• Support adding the field. Argento Surfer (talk) 16:31, 3 August 2021 (UTC)
• Would you kindly provide a recommended documentation update to accompany this? Adding the parameter is unlikely to fix the issue unless people actually know what the parameter is for and its differences. I have to assume that a contributing factor to the erroneous additions is a close association between the word alias and the term AKA. Honestly, thanks to the word epithet itself and general human laziness, even with a good documentation update, I think the issue will persist until someone knowledgable of the difference corrects each instance on a particular page. I wonder if changing alias to AKA would be an easier solution to implement and enforce. Probably runs more risk of bloat, though. -2pou (talk) 18:19, 3 August 2021 (UTC)
• {{reply|2pou}} Editors seeing the epithets/nicknames in the proper field instead of in the aliases section is enough to prevent the issue from occurring again, I think, especially if the epithets parameter is next to the aliases.
  SinkingInMercury (talk) 01:38, 4 August 2021 (UTC)

• Question - will these be restricted to epithets from the comics themselves, or will any purple prose from any review/blog/reaction/whatnot be added to this? - jc37 03:37, 4 August 2021 (UTC)
• : In addition, do we expect that the big red cheese, boy blunder, the blue boy scout, and other such epithets would also be added? - jc37 03:39, 4 August 2021 (UTC)
• ::{{reply|Jc37}} Should generally be restricted to ephitets from the comics, with maybe an exception for notable unofficial epithets SinkingInMercury (talk) 04:31, 4 August 2021 (UTC)
• :::Teen Titans characters - Robin-o, Legs, Gillhead, Twinkletoes, Wonder Chick, Boy Bowman, etc.
• :::And Stan Lee created new ones in nearly every comic. Webhead, web slinger, Green Goliath, etc etc.
• :::All of these really require contextual explanations, the kind of thing we consistantly have said are not the kind of thing that should be in the info box. I understand the goal of this, but it would be creating more problems, and inviting WP:OR, amongst many other issues. - jc37 04:50, 4 August 2021 (UTC)
• ::::{{reply|Jc37}}Those aren't epithets though, just nicknames, but I do understand your point. Maybe linking the epithets parameter text to the wiktionary definition for epithet might help, as well as hidden text in the parameter stating nicknames are not epithets or "avoid putting non-notable epithets or nicknames"?
  Also, I think that the current "notable aliases" section also invites OR anyway just as much as an epithets parameter would, with non-notable aliases or nicknames like {{diff|Two-Face|994966689|994806656|this}} or {{diff|Two-Face|370880428|370847790|this}} being listed in it at times. SinkingInMercury (talk) 05:41, 4 August 2021 (UTC)
• :::::Actually, per wiktionary, wikt:epithet, wikt:cognomen, and wikt:nickname are all synonyms.
• :::::Which makes this a solution to a problem which creates similar and more problems... - jc37 17:58, 4 August 2021 (UTC)
• I agree with Jc37 here, and feel I have to mention that epithets are far from the only issue plaguing the alias field. For example, I often see people adding diminutives to the field, such as "Pete" and "Petey" for Spider-Man. In addition, I suspect an epithet field would fall victim to a trend I've seen on Wikipedia where editors act like little children whose sibling has just got a new toy: Only a tiny fraction (I'd guess less than 0.1%) of comics characters have epithets that are significant enough that they could justifiably be mentioned in their infobox, but once the epithet field pops up in a few articles, many editors will start feeling like an article is in some way inferior if it doesn't have that field, so they will resort to any stretch of logic to put something in that field for their favorite characters. If the character doesn't have a notable epithet, use one that popped up in a single line of a single appearance; if they don't have any epithets, make one up. I've seen the same thing happen to many infobox fields.--NukeofEarl (talk) 19:28, 8 August 2021 (UTC)
• Support Yes, it should be included based on what I've read above. The upsides outweigh the downsides, in my opinion. Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 19:28, 10 August 2021 (UTC)
• Support It seems useful and concise Yleventa2 (talk) 17:46, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

:What limit is there on this? Do we include "Bats" because the Joker uses it a lot? It seems like something that will just be abused. Darkwarriorblake / SEXY ACTION TALK PAGE! 17:51, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

::{{reply to| Darkwarriorblake}} Should be limited to epithets that fit the definition from [https://www.dailywritingtips.com/epithets-add-character/ this website]: "a word or phrase used in place of or in addition to a name to characterize the person, place, or thing. In fiction or nonfiction, it’s an effective device for evoking the subject’s qualities and for elegant variation." Examples of this are the epithets listed [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SuperheroSobriquets here]. SinkingInMercury (talk) 03:18, 6 September 2021 (UTC)

• Support, User:SinkingInMercury makes a convincing case that this will reduce confusion and prevent mistakes.--Droid I am (talk) 09:27, 6 October 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose, I expect the downsides will far outweigh the benefits. While I concede that there are a handful of superheroes with notable or defining nicknames ("Robin, Boy Wonder", "The Dark Knight", etc.), I think that this parameter will end up as a fancruft magnet with endless lists of nicknames for even minor characters. I present the [https://marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Iron_Man Marvel Cinematic Universe Fandom page on Iron Man] (infobox section "Alias(es)") as an (admittedly over-the-top) example of what I expect this field will look like. Either that or we will get bogged down in endless debates about what constitutes a "notable" epithet...and the irrelevant nicknames will get added anyway. GeneralNotability (talk) 21:49, 6 October 2021 (UTC)
• Support Meaningful distinction. But the epithets should be sourced with citations to merit inclusion. Dimadick (talk) 08:53, 9 October 2021 (UTC)
• Support Yes. It should be a parameter based off of what nom and others said, but like Dimadick said, there should probably be citations to merit inclusion. Rexh17 (talk) 01:05, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

{{abot}}

Regarding [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hal_Jordan&diff=1133132205&oldid=1133041461 this edit], should the Species parameter be used even for humans? DonIago (talk) 15:29, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2025 June 19#Category:Character pop - I figured I'd put this in this talk page as this discussion would only be complete with the editing of the template User:D Kirlston - talk 02:31, 19 June 2025 (UTC)

:It appears that this category is assigned to all pages in article space that use this template. That is not necessary; there are tools to make such lists. It should be removed entirely. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:17, 19 June 2025 (UTC)

I propose removing all of the "Character type categories" from this template per WP:TEMPLATECAT: {{tq|it is recommended that articles not be placed in ordinary content categories using templates}}. Categories should be assigned manually on article pages. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:17, 19 June 2025 (UTC)