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Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2021 December 12

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= December 12 =

== Category:Horse farms by country ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: merge (if appropriate also to :Category:Horse farms in Europe). Renaming to stud farms requires a fresh discussion because it impacts the whole tree. (non-admin closure) Marcocapelle (talk) 06:02, 20 December 2021 (UTC)

Nominator's rationale: {{strikethrough|There are just two articles total populating :Category:Farms in Cambodia and :Category:Forestry in Cambodia. Deleting both categories and moving the articles to :Category:Agriculture in Cambodia seems best. Rename :Category:Farms in China to missing parent category :Category:Agricultural buildings in China. Merge :Category:Farms in Hong Kong (one article) to :Category:Agricultural buildings in Hong Kong (two articles). :Category:Farms in Costa Rica is not worthy of sub-category of :Category:Agriculture in Costa Rica at the moment. Many of the other listings are too small and/or do not follow the correct categorization scheme. –Aidan721 (talk) 22:26, 12 December 2021 (UTC)}} Nomination updated below. –Aidan721 (talk) 22:37, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

  • Comments - a merge to {{cl|Farms}} appears to be rather blatantly absent. Also a farm to me is not an agricultural building (a farmhouse is a building) - it is the nominator who has recently placed farms under buildings ([https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Category:Farms_in_England&type=revision&diff=1060023632&oldid=845268828&diffmode=source diff]). WP:SMALLCAT explicitly allows the existence of small categories, as part of a scheme such as {{cl|Farms by country}}. Is there really only 1 notable farm in Germany? Oculi (talk) 01:47, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

:* {{cl|Farms}} is currently a sub-cat of {{cl|Agricultural buildings}} so I was merely continuing that scheme down through the countries. My main concern is that of the 19 sub-cats of {{cl|Horse farms}}, 8 of them hold just one page. So is breaking those down by country really an effective scheme? There are also many categories within the {{cl|Farms by country}} that contain just Category:Horse farms in . Perhaps if {{cl|Farms}} is removed from {{cl|Agricultural buildings}} then many of these proposals are overkill, but nonetheless, I believe there are still some issues in this scheme. –Aidan721 (talk) 02:28, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

  • Oppose any straight deletion: if categories are not kept, they should be upmerged. Oppose any single merge: if categories are merged, it should be a dual merge. Besides it might be helpful for the discussion to split the nomination in multiple subsections (e.g. horse farms in a separate subsection), that can still be done. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:43, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

:* With the updated nomination the above has become moot. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:48, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

  • Nominator update. Reducing the nomination to just horse farms categories is a much more manageable discussion. I propose a full unmerge of the listed categories.
  • Support the update. Oculi (talk) 02:07, 14 December 2021 (UTC)
  • Oppose -- The majority seem to be described as stud or stud farms. In my country, I believe that the function of these is for an owner to bring a mare to be covered by a stallion. This is not necessarily related to horse-racing. I would support renaming to :Category:Stud farms in Austria etc and then merging small cats to :Category:Stud farms in Europe. The Spanish category has a military name, and may be where their cavalry horses are bred. According to the strict definition a farm is not a set of buildings but the buildings and the land cultivated. On the other hand, the keeping of horses (unless for ploughing etc) is not a branch of agriculture. However that does not take the matter further. Peterkingiron (talk) 16:10, 16 December 2021 (UTC)

:* {{ping|Peterkingiron}} I would now agree that horse racing is unrelated to the vast majority of these articles and that Stud farms in country is a better name for these categories as Stud farm is the eponymous article of {{cl|Horse farms]]. Would you support the nomination if the horse racing categories are removed and all collectively changed to stud farms. (Note: the name change to :Category:Stud farms may need to be its own separate proposal). I think diffusing horse/stud farms by continent is an improved approach. –Aidan721 (talk) 16:22, 19 December 2021 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Culture in England by region ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: keep. bibliomaniac15 18:58, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

  • Propose deleting {{lc|Culture in England by region}}
  • Propose deleting {{lc|Culture in the East Midlands}}
  • Propose deleting {{lc|Culture in the West Midlands (region)}}

Nominator's rationale: Unnecessary duplicate which is redundant with :Category:Culture in England by county, which already covers the whole of the country. Also delete the first-level sub-cats; as these are also redundant to the existing categorisation scheme. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 20:37, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Classic women blues singers ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:Classic female blues singers. bibliomaniac15 18:58, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Nominator's rationale: This category was speedy renamed based on a larger scope discussion to change "female" to "women" for similar categories, but this is a genre of blues called "classic female blues". So those placed in this category are singers of classic female blues. An alternative could be :Category:Women classic blues singers. StarcheerspeaksnewslostwarsTalk to me 21:17, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Marcocapelle (talk) 18:31, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

  • Support per nom. "Classic female blues" is the style. These are singers of the style (and my understanding is they would all have to be women). The parent cat name isn't a locked-in factor: it's other subcats include American contraltos, American sopranos and American girl groups, all of which are logically populated with articles on women, but the word itself is not required to be present when the categorisation is gender-specific without it. Crowsus (talk) 07:31, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Fictional castles and fortresses ==

File:Symbol move vote.svg Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2021 December 20%23Category:Fictional castles and fortresses

==Category:Cryptocurrencies==

File:Symbol move vote.svg Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 February 2%23Category:Cryptocurrencies

== Category:Demolished hotels in the United States ==

File:Symbol move vote.svg Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2021 December 21%23Category:Demolished hotels in the United States

== Category:Incest in legend ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. bibliomaniac15 19:02, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Nominator's rationale: This category is small, and there is no real need to have them both. ★Trekker (talk) 10:18, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

  • Oppose, legends and myths are two different things. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:49, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
  • Legends is just a subset of myth that happen to be inspired by possible true things as far as I'm aware. And regarless the legend category here is very small, so I don't see how it could be kept.★Trekker (talk) 12:13, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
  • Alternatively, both could be merged into "Incest in folklore". The difference between myths and legends are not that significant, and if both categories are rather small, one larger one would make sense. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 04:52, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

:* The difference is big enough that we have two separate category trees for them. Besides mythology (e.g. ancient Greek and Roman mythology) would never fall under folklore. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:53, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

:::Pretty sure they can. The folklore article even states that myths are a genre of folklore..★Trekker (talk) 12:13, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Ministers of Government of Bolivia ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. bibliomaniac15 19:06, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Nominator's rationale: Keeps the category name in line with other categories under :Category:Ministers of Internal Affairs by country, avoid confusion with :Category:Government ministers of Bolivia, and the ministry itself has been interchangeably gone under the title "Ministry of Government" or "Ministry of Interior" without real difference. In addition, pretty much all external media outlets translate the name to "minister of the interior".Krisgabwoosh (talk) 01:34, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Marcocapelle (talk) 06:43, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

  • Relisting comment, the category page was not tagged yet. I have done that now. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:45, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
  • Oppose see Ministry of Government (Bolivia). Possibly rename to :Category:Ministers of Government (Bolivia). The list article appears to indicate that the post is usually held jointly with another ministry, sometimes interior and sometimes Foreign affairs. I agree this is complicated and confusing. Peterkingiron (talk) 21:08, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
  • :I created the list so I suppose I could shine some light on that. The Ministry of Government itself has, at various points, gone under the "government" or "interior" title interchangeably (but never at the same time). Other portfolios have been added and removed from it often but I should not that attaching random departments to ministries isn't uncommon (before becoming its own office, foreign affairs was at multiple times an appendage of either the education and finance ministries, for example).
  • :Also, I suppose I should add that most external sources translate "minister of government" to "minister of the interior".{{Cite news|date=2021-05-26|title=US charges ex-Bolivian minister with bribery, money laundering|work=Al Jazeera|url=https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/5/26/us-arrests-former-bolivian-minister-for-bribery-money-laundering|access-date=2021-12-07|quote=US accuses former Bolivian Interior Minister Arturo Murillo of receiving bribes from US company and individuals.}}{{Cite news|date=2019-11-24|title=New Bolivian interior minister vows to jail Evo Morales for rest of his life|work=The Guardian|url=https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/nov/24/bolivia-evo-morales-vow-jail-rest-life-arturo-murillo|access-date=2021-12-07}}{{Cite news|title=US charges Bolivian ex-minister Murillo with corruption|work=BBC|url=https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-57268054|access-date=2021-12-07|quote=Bolivian ex-Interior Minister Arturo Murillo has been charged in the US with corruption and money laundering.}}
  • :{{Reflist}} Krisgabwoosh (talk) 22:11, 7 December 2021 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Marcocapelle (talk) 07:34, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

  • Further comment -- Our category names should reflect national usage. The title of the British finance minister is Chancellor of the Exchequer. No doubt newspapers abroad would call him the finance minister and we would have him in a finance ministers category, but WP should not impose its nomenclature. The title is minister of government (or rather that in Spanish) and we should reflect that. Peterkingiron (talk) 16:18, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
  • Comment, according to the infoboxes in the articles, 12 were Minister of Government, while 6 were Minister of the Interior. Marcocapelle (talk) 00:27, 27 December 2021 (UTC)
  • Comment, I should note that :Category:Ministers of Economy and Public Finance of Bolivia was recently renamed to :Category:Finance ministers of Bolivia for the same reason I seek to change the title of this category. That being, the category includes all ministers who went under various titles throughout the years rather than just the current ones. Krisgabwoosh (talk) 01:34, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Descendants of Ikshvaku, Category:Suryavansha, Category:Raghuvamsa ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: merge except for :Category:Suryavansha. bibliomaniac15 19:05, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Nominator's rationale: Duplication of Ikshvaku dynasty Redtigerxyz Talk 06:05, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.