Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 May 23#Category:Depictions of people
= May 23 =
== Category:Songs written by Chandrabose ==
:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
:The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 22:01, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
:* Propose renaming :Category:Songs written by Chandrabose to :Category:Songs with lyrics by Chandrabose (lyricist)
:Nominator's rationale: To match article name (C2D) and Chandrabose is clearly identified as a lyricist and not a songwriter. Richhoncho (talk) 23:12, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
- {{ping|Richhoncho}} all sibling categories have the format "Songs written by", why would we change that in this one occasion? Marcocapelle (talk) 04:53, 31 May 2022 (UTC)
::{{ping|Marcocapelle}} Not changing, there are 2 subcats of songs by songwriter, :Category:Songs by composer and :Category:Songs by lyricist and members of the lyricist cat take the the form I have suggested. --Richhoncho (talk) 07:40, 31 May 2022 (UTC)
::* I see. So the category should then also be re-parented. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:39, 10 June 2022 (UTC)
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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
== Category:English Catholics ==
:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
:The result of the discussion was: keep. – Fayenatic London 13:27, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
:* Propose merging :Category:English Catholics to :Category:English Roman Catholics
:Nominator's rationale: Unclear what distinction is intended. Rathfelder (talk) 20:22, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
- Keep - the distinction is that not all Catholics are Roman Catholics as can be seen from the subcats. The main article and the parent categories have been changed surreptitiously and should be changed back. Oculi (talk) 21:43, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
- Keep per Oculi. Laurel Lodged (talk) 23:12, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
- The only other content is :Category:English Old Catholics. Should we rename that after the article Old Roman Catholic Church in Great Britain? As it is the category is misleading. I removed a number of articles about English Roman Catholics. Rathfelder (talk) 08:10, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
- Keep -- Whatever the right name for the Old Catholic denomination, it is a small one and not in Communion with Rome. Accordingly, the present structure is the right one. Peterkingiron (talk) 16:09, 27 May 2022 (UTC)
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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
== Category:Depictions of people ==
:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
:The result of the discussion was: keep. – Fayenatic London 13:29, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
:* Propose merging :Category:Depictions of people to :Category:Art depicting people
:Nominator's rationale: We don't have :Category:Depictions. How's the scope different from :Category:Art depicting people? Are there non-art depictions of people? The only remaining subcategory here is :Cultural depictions of people, which per the discussion here should probably renamed to :Category:People in culture since it's part of :Category:Topics in culture. This parent category is just unnecessary. (Also, since this is under :Category:Works by topic, I guess it could be alternatively renamed to :Category:Works about people instead of being deleted, if there is preference that it should be kept). Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 18:03, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
- Support per nom. We now have three container categories on top: depictions, cultural depictions and depictions in art. Reducing them to two categories is a no-brainer and keeping depictions in art as a separate subcategory makes sense too. Besides it is a really nice and creative suggestion of having :Category:Works about people instead of :Category:Depictions of people and :Category:Cultural depictions of people, consistent with the "Works about" tree. Ultimately we probably will no longer need any "depictions" category at all, they can all be replaced with "works about". Marcocapelle (talk) 18:59, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
- Very Strong Oppose to the proposed merge, which is a non-starter. In WP categories it is well-established that "art" means exclusively visual art, not "artistic works in any medium". See for example the contents of :Category:Art depicting New Testament people. So, yes there are non-art depictions of people in WP terms, and that is how the scope differs. The "depictions" categories include literature, films & all sorts, not to mention non-artistic works in :Category:Biographical works, and we should continue this distinction. Marcocapelle, I'm surprised to see you supporting this one. :Category:Works about people might be a way forward, but I doubt everything in the tree is a work -there are probably quite a few like Media portrayals of transgender people. Johnbod (talk) 03:31, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
:* The way I understand the nomination is: merge :Cultural depictions of people to :Depictions of people and rename it; but leave :Category:Art depicting people well alone. That is not exactly how User:Piotrus phrased it but I am quite sure, based on the rationale, that this is how they meant it. Leaving :Category:Art depicting people well alone is what you plea for as well, for obvious reasons. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:32, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
:::You may be right, but that isn't at all what the nomination actually says. If you are right, it should be restated. Johnbod (talk) 15:59, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
:*:@Marcocapelle Indeed. Although another thing emerges for consideration: the difference (if any) between :Category:Works by topic and :Category:Fiction by topic. Fiction is two-levels down, under Works by topic-Literature by topic. Our article on fiction notes that this is the narrow understanding of fiction (" written narratives in prose"). But in my experience, most articles named "Foo in fiction" and related categories discuss the broader meaning ("imaginary narratives expressed in any medium"). What I am getting at here is whether the location of :Category:Fiction by topic in the category tree is correct (under literature), or whether we need some sort of split, one for narrow meaning, one for larger meaning (and how they should be named?). Not sure if there is a better place to discuss this (the talk page of that category, perhaps?). Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 08:44, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
- Keep If anything, :Category:Art depicting people should be moved down a layer and a redundant layer removed. That could probably be achieved by merging :Category:Cultural depictions of people to :Category:Depictions of people. Peterkingiron (talk) 16:15, 27 May 2022 (UTC)
:* Fair enough, we may merge this first and leave the discussion about renaming to :Category:Works about people to a fresh discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:26, 28 May 2022 (UTC)
- Keep per Johnbod. Randy Kryn (talk) 16:14, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
== Category:Christmas markets in France ==
:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 22:05, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
:* Propose merging :Category:Christmas markets in France to :Category:Christmas in France and :Category:Christmas markets
:Nominator's rationale: merge per WP:SMALLCAT, currently only one article. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:13, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
== Category:Orchestras by genre ==
:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 22:07, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
:* Propose merging :Category:Orchestras by genre to :Category:Orchestras
:Nominator's rationale: merge, redundant category layer with only one subcategory. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:08, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
