Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 December 15#Category:Forbes family (publishers)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge to :Category:Track and field competitions in Los Angeles and :Category:Marathons in California. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:44, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Los Angeles Marathon}}

:Nominator's rationale: Only one running of the annual event has its own article making this category unnecessary. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 18:00, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Support in principle, but merge to :Category:Sports competitions in Los Angeles and :Category:Marathons in California. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:17, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• Support but merge to :Category:Track and field competitions in Los Angeles (just created) and :Category:Marathons in California.--User:Namiba 15:33, 17 December 2024 (UTC)
• Support but merge per Namiba and Marcocapelle. - jc37 16:57, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete (non-admin closure). –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:44, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Van Hamme family}}

:Nominator's rationale: Delete for now. There are only two pages in this family category that are a father-son pair ^SMason_Garrison 17:01, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom, the articles are already directly interlinked. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:24, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete (non-admin closure). ~/Bunnypranav:<ping> 12:56, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Alizoti family}}

:Nominator's rationale: Delete for now. There are only two pages in this family category that aren't clearly related. ^SMason_Garrison 17:00, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:26, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete (non-admin closure). –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:43, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Döbeln family}}

:Nominator's rationale: Delete for now. There are only two pages in this family category that are related somehow? ^SMason_Garrison 16:33, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom, the articles are already directly interlinked. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:47, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: keep. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 03:55, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Armfelt family}}

:Nominator's rationale: Delete for now. There are only two pages in this family category that are already interlinked as great granddaughter and great grandfather pair ^SMason_Garrison 16:32, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:48, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Nomination seems moot by now. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:34, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

• Keep. The category has now 7 articles. 85.76.43.162 (talk) 21:54, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete (non-admin closure). –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:45, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Liljencrantz family}}

:Nominator's rationale: Delete for now. There are only two pages in this family category that are already interlinked as a sister pair. ^SMason_Garrison 16:30, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:49, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete (non-admin closure). –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:45, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Tengbom family}}

:Nominator's rationale: Delete for now. There are only two pages in this family category that are already interlinked as a father-daughter pair. ^SMason_Garrison 16:28, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:49, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename and redirect. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:45, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:LGBTQ+ Wikipedians to :Category:LGBTQ Wikipedians

:Nominator's rationale: The article about this subject is at LGBTQ (LGBTQ+ redirects to it). Gonnym (talk) 16:25, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

::Support in principle, but shouldn't this be redirected? ^SMason_Garrison 16:59, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename (non-admin closure). ~/Bunnypranav:<ping> 12:57, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Plant cognition to :Category:Plant intelligence

:Nominator's rationale: The main article is Plant intelligence, this category should be changed to the same as the main article. Psychologist Guy (talk) 13:59, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Rename per WP:C2D. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:49, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: manual merge to :Category:Tamil-language television series (or subcategories thereof when applicable) HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 04:44, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Tamil-language web series to :Category:Tamil-language streaming television series.

:Nominator's rationale: By defintion, none of the series listed here are web series and are actually streaming television series. Notice how some of the series include in their title (TV series). DareshMohan (talk) 11:18, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Move articles to the tree of :Category:Tamil-language television series when appropriate. If no articles are left the category can simply be deleted as empty. Renaming to :Category:Tamil-language streaming television series is not needed, we do not even have :Category:Streaming television series. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:56, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• :The television project could never come to a consensus on what the distinction between a web series, a streaming series and a (modern) TV series, so until such a time, it's probably best to go with what Marcocapelle said, and just use the general TV category tree. Gonnym (talk) 10:21, 16 December 2024 (UTC)
• Purge and Merge, per Marcocapelle. - jc37 16:59, 18 December 2024 (UTC)
• Merge Pages will need to be placed in the most specific applicable subcategories and checked for existing membership within those categories. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:47, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:48, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming {{lc|Category:Women's Championship (England)}} Moved to speedy request per WP:C2D. Apologies to users for unnecessary bot notifications. CNC (talk) 14:28, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• {{ping|CommunityNotesContributor}} as the speedy nomination was opposed, do you want to re-open the discussion here, or do you withdraw the proposal entirely? Marcocapelle (talk) 22:34, 16 December 2024 (UTC)
• :Please withdraw, I think that's the better option for now. CNC (talk) 13:34, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete (non-admin closure). –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:48, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Salvo weapons}}

:Nominator's rationale: "Salvo weapon" is overly vague, any gun or rocket can fire salvos when in a group with other guns or rockets. The category members are already in other similar categories like :Category:Multiple-barrel firearms and :Category:Multiple rocket launchers, making this category redundant. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 09:06, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete - per Salvo, this is about an act of multiple weapons, which is not categorizable; or a single weapon that can do multiple simultaneous attacks, which are already categorized (as noted by Zxcvbnm). - jc37 17:04, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 06:27, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting :Category:3rd century in education (1 C)

:* Propose deleting :Category:4th century in education (1 C)

:* Propose deleting :Category:5th century in education (1 C)

:* Propose deleting :Category:6th century in education (1 C)

:* Propose deleting :Category:7th century in education (1 C)

:* Propose deleting :Category:8th century in education (2 C, 1 P)

:* Propose deleting :Category:9th century in education (1 C)

:* Propose deleting :Category:10th century in education (1 C, 1 P)

:Nominator's rationale: merge, redundant category layer with mostly only one subcategory. The subcategories and articles have already been appropriately categorized in the century trees. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:44, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

::Delete per nom. :Category:1st millennium in education might be appropriate, but it would contain none of the contents here except possibly the two articles. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:52, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

::Marcocapelle, your nomination implies a merge, but you have not specified a target. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 03:55, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

::* {{ping|HouseBlaster}} that is correct, the subcategory is already in e.g. :Category:Educational institutions established in the 1st millennium and :Category:Organizations established in the 3rd century and that is all we need. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:25, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete :Category:Lemos Family. No consensus to rename :Category:Lemos family, but that can be the subject of its own discussion. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 04:39, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Lemos Family to :Category:Lemos family (Colombia)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Lemos family to :Category:Lemos family (Greece)

:Nominator's rationale: These are two separate families from different countries. Mike Selinker (talk) 07:57, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete :Category:Lemos Family, the articles are not related to each other, it is not even clear if the subjects of the articles were of the same family. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:00, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• That seems right. OK, in that case, we would just leave :Category:Lemos family (the Greek one) as it is.--Mike Selinker (talk) 01:12, 16 December 2024 (UTC)
• Rename :Category:Lemos family to :Category:Lemos family (Greece) in order to avoid that the Colombian articles are added to that category. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:44, 16 December 2024 (UTC)
• Delete and keep, respectively, per Selinker. We don't do disambiguations where the base title is empty, and in practice it is unlikely to attract misplaced entries from Lemos (surname). –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 05:36, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename (non-admin closure). ~/Bunnypranav:<ping> 12:58, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Wright family (English family) to :Category:Wright family (England)

:Nominator's rationale: Matching other categories with "England" in the title. It doesn't need "family" twice.--Mike Selinker (talk) 07:50, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

::Rename per nom. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:54, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete. :Category:Lara Family. No consensus to rename :Category:Lara family, but that can be the subject of its own discussion. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 04:40, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Lara Family to :Category:Lara family (Colombia)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Lara family to :Category:Lara family (Mexico)

:Nominator's rationale: These two families are distinct political families from different countries. Mike Selinker (talk) 07:02, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete :Category:Lara Family, only two articles and they are already interlinked directly. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:06, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• That'd be fine by me too. In that case, :Category:Lara family would remain as is.--Mike Selinker (talk) 01:12, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Rename :Category:Lara family to :Category:Lara family (Mexico) in order to avoid that the Colombian articles are added to that category. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:46, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete and keep, respectively, per Marcocapelle. We don't use disambiguations without a base title. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 05:37, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename (non-admin closure). ~/Bunnypranav:<ping> 13:00, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Ford political family to :Category:Ford family (Canada)

:Nominator's rationale: No offense to my Canadian friends, but this is definitely not the first family I think of when I think "Ford political family." Mike Selinker (talk) 06:58, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

::Rename Insufficiently disambiguated from :Category:Family of Gerald Ford. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 04:55, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename (non-admin closure). ~/Bunnypranav:<ping> 13:00, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Marshall family (political family) to :Category:Marshall political family

:** :Category:Smith family (politics) to :Category:Smith political family

:** :Category:Canning family (political) to :Category:Canning political family

:** :Category:Ewing family (politics and military) to :Category:Ewing political family

:Nominator's rationale: Mike Selinker (talk) 07:59, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

:Nominator's rationale: Per categories like :Category:Abdullah political family and :Category:Woodworth political family, the disambiguator is built into the name of :Category:Political families. Mike Selinker (talk) 06:28, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

:Support Clear enough for disambiguation. Dimadick (talk) 11:48, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename all except for deleting :Category:Blackwood family (publishers). HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 04:07, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Graham family (newspapers) to :Category:Graham family (publishing)

:** :Category:Knight family (newspapermen) to :Category:Knight family (publishing)

:** :Category:Fairfax family (publishers) to :Category:Fairfax family (publishing)

:** :Category:Forbes family (publishers) to :Category:Forbes family (publishing)

:** :Category:Johnson publishing family to :Category:Johnson family (publishing)

:** :Category:Blackwood family (publishers) to :Category:Blackwood family (publishing)

:** :Category:Brown family (newspaper publishers) to :Category:Brown family (publishing)

:Nominator's rationale: These subcategories of :Category:Publishing families need disambiguation, and I'd just standardize them to the style of :Category:Simon family (publishing) since publishers tend to publish lots of things. Mike Selinker (talk) 05:58, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

::that's a nice proposal and cleanup there, support Nayyn (talk) 18:42, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Delete :Category:Blackwood family (publishers), only two articles and they are already directly interlinked. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:11, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• OK by me.--Mike Selinker (talk) 01:13, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:Collins family (England). HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 04:07, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Collins family (English writers and artists) to :Category:Collins arts family

:Nominator's rationale: Of all possible analogues, this is closest to the category :Category:Nicholson arts family. Mike Selinker (talk) 05:46, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• {{cl|Collins family (England)}} might be better, per several other similar categories (e.g., {{cl|Benson family (England)}}, {{cl|Baldwin family (United Kingdom)}}, {{cl|Goring family (England)}}, and {{cl|Wharton family (England)}}). Might also be worth changing {{cl|Collins family}} to {{cl|Collins family (Ireland)}} to reduce confusion. Grutness...wha? 11:11, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• Fine by me. If folks agree, let's do that.--Mike Selinker (talk) 01:14, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:Family of George Gilbert Scott. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 03:58, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Scott family (architects) to :Category:Scott family (architecture)

:Nominator's rationale: Generally :Category:Families by occupation subcategories needing disambiguation use the occupation and a grouping of practitioners like "architects." Mike Selinker (talk) 05:45, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Rename to :Category:Family of George Gilbert Scott. Thomas Scott (commentator) and Dukinfield Henry Scott in this category weren't architects. The most notable figure in this is category is George Gilbert Scott – Thomas Scott's son, D. H. Scott's father, the first architect in this dynasty and the most prolific British architect of the Victorian age. Ham II (talk) 17:56, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• Fine by me.--Mike Selinker (talk) 01:14, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: keep. Appears to have been withdrawn, and no support for the nomination. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 04:06, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Muslim supporters of Israel to :Category:Muslim Zionists

:Nominator's rationale: See the discussion in #Category:Arab supporters of Israel below. I've given my own arguments there. Basically it's for the sake of consistency; :Category:Arab Zionists, :Category:Christian Zionists, :Category:Muslim Zionists. Do you get what I mean? AHI-3000 (talk) 03:50, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

::@Dimadick and @Smasongarrison: What do you think? AHI-3000 (talk) 20:06, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

:::I still think what I wrote below -- that the names need to be consistent. I don't understand why you keep tagging me. I've already stated that I thought you should have just added this nomination to the discussion below. ^SMason_Garrison 23:35, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

::::@Smasongarrison: I'm replying to you. So you suggest that I just edit the discussion below (at #Category:Arab supporters of Israel) to nominate both of these two categories? AHI-3000 (talk) 09:26, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

:::::That is what I suggested several days ago. In several places. However, you can't now because there are now responses to both nominations. ^SMason_Garrison 14:37, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

::I am requesting someone to close this discussion, because #Category:Arab supporters of Israel already has both of these two closely related categories proposed together, the debate concerns both of them. AHI-3000 (talk) 23:16, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose, Zionism and Christian Zionism are specific ideologies. Just support for the existence of the state Israel with Jewish inhabitants does not immediately make you a Zionist (if that were the case then the United Nations would be a Zionist organization). Christian Zionism exists specifically within Evangelical Christianity. There is no Muslim Zionism ideology, the article with this name has incorrectly been moved only a few days ago. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:21, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose per above. It's eminently possible to support Israel without being a Zionist. Grutness...wha? 03:43, 16 December 2024 (UTC)
• Comment I don't see how this could be true. Who else would support Israel's military policies and its long-term occupation of Syrian and Palestinian areas? Dimadick (talk) 10:58, 17 December 2024 (UTC)
• Who says that people who support the existence of Israel also support its military policies? Marcocapelle (talk) 11:12, 17 December 2024 (UTC)
• Very good point. It's easily possible support the right for somewhere to exist without being a fan of its policies. Grutness...wha? 04:14, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge to :Category:LGBTQ and Pentecostalism. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 03:57, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Anti-LGBTQ and Pentecostal churches to :Category:LGBTQ and Pentecostalism

:Nominator's rationale: Only one subcategory, not usefully or pickily navigational. --MikutoH ^talk! 02:37, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

::Wouldn't that remove the child category from the other parent of Category:Anti-LGBTQ and Christianity? ^SMason_Garrison 03:34, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

:Comment Very strange title for a category. Are we supposed to categorise all Anti-LGBTQ churches here? Dimadick (talk) 03:38, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. A second merge target is not needed, the subcategory is already in :Category:Anti-LGBTQ Christian activists. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:41, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: merge all. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 03:56, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Sport shooters from Odisha to :Category:Sportspeople from Odisha

:Nominator's rationale: Category with just one entry. Lost in Quebec (talk) 01:27, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

Also nominating for merging

• :Category:Martial artists from Odisha to :Category:Sportspeople from Odisha
• :Category:Mountain climbers from Odisha to :Category:Sportspeople from Odisha
• :Category:Basketball players from Odisha to :Category:Sportspeople from Odisha

All categories with just 1 or 2 entries.Lost in Quebec (talk) 01:32, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:43, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:Wilson family (show business). HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 03:56, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Wilson family (The Beach Boys) to :Category:Wilson musical family

:Nominator's rationale: All other subcategories of :Category:Show business families where most are musicians use "X musical family" as a disambiguator, such as :Category:Gibb musical family. Some instead use "X family (show business)" so this could instead be :Category:Wilson family (show business) as per the nomination below. Mike Selinker (talk) 04:37, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Rename using (show business), per Show business. Saying they are a "musical family", could sound like we're categorizing by personal attribute, rather than profession. - jc37 17:14, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: rename (non-admin closure). ~/Bunnypranav:<ping> 13:02, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Baldwin acting family to :Category:Baldwin family (show business)

:** :Category:Curtis family (acting) to :Category:Curtis family (show business)

:** :Category:Fisher family (acting) to :Category:Fisher family (show business)

:** :Category:Howard family (acting) to :Category:Howard family (show business)

:** :Category:Guinness family (acting) to :Category:Guinness family (show business)

:** :Category:Penn family (acting) to :Category:Penn family (show business)

:** :Category:Newman family (acting) to :Category:Newman family (show business)

:** :Category:Roberts family (acting) to :Category:Roberts family (show business)

:** :Category:Scott family (filmmaking) to :Category:Scott family (show business)

:** :Category:Allen family (entertainment) to :Category:Allen family (show business)

:** :Category:Mortimer family (drama) to :Category:Mortimer family (show business)

:Nominator's rationale: These are mostly subcategories or sub-subcategories of :Category:Show business families. Most other such families use "show business" as their disambiguator (such as :Category:Ladd family (show business), likely since actors direct, write, play music, and other show bizzy things.-- Mike Selinker (talk) 00:15, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

• Support To match the parent category. Dimadick (talk) 03:39, 15 December 2024 (UTC)
• Support, to match parent. Though, I wish we had a better general term overall. "Entertainment industry" is probably more accurate, but seems a bit too much. So I dunno. Going with what we have for now. - jc37 17:14, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.