Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 January 5

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: dual merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:04, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose splitting :Category:Catholic universities and colleges in Honduras to :Category:Catholic universities and colleges in North America and :Category:Catholicism in Honduras

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge for now. There is only one university in here, which isn't helpful for navigation. Mason (talk) 23:56, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Dual merge per nom, without objection to recreate the category when more articles are available. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:32, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
• Dual merge (as creator) in the absence of more content. However I reverted your {{oldid2|1193849590|addition}} of {{Cl|Universities and colleges in Honduras}} to the article, which is redundant as the article is already in {{Cl|Universities in Honduras}}. {{Re|Smasongarrison}} may I ask why you phrase your nominations as splitting instead of merging to all parents, which can be automated? In my understanding splitting is something else, which is when a category combines two or more different notions, and some articles must be manually moved to target category A, some others to target category B, but not both categories (e.g. splitting a category for queens between queens regnant and queens consorts). Place Clichy (talk) 12:11, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
• :Happy to answer the splitting question. So the twinkle app doesn't at present give an option to merge into two categories, so I've been using split instead. I've made a request that they include the option as there is a template. My reasoning is that it's better to include the additional category at the expense of the wrong verb. Mason (talk) 17:14, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
• :: I see! Place Clichy (talk) 15:31, 7 January 2024 (UTC)
• Dual merge per nom. –Aidan721 (talk) 15:43, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

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:The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:06, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Batman: Arkham characters}}

:Nominator's rationale: Feels WP:INDISCRIMINATE. If it were just a list of characters from the Batman: Arkham series (with the articles listed being about the versions from the Batman: Arkham series) that would be fine. This also might be an WP:OVERLAPCAT with other Batman categories. (Oinkers42) (talk) 17:43, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Delete, these are not Batman: Arkham characters, they're just Batman characters. This category should be populated by specific versions from those games and original characters created for the games, not by what's filled with now. —El Millo (talk) 01:17, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

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:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. (non-admin closure) Seawolf35 ^T--C 16:48, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Tyla (South African singer)}}

:Nominator's rationale: A total of three related articles (one album and two songs) doesn't seem to be enough to justify an eponymous category yet. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 19:06, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

::Oppose, the category has then been significantly improved. dxneo (talk) 10:05, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

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• Delete, apart from the eponymous article, the songs and albums (which all link to each other anyway) there is only an article about a tour. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:19, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

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::Delete per Marco. Omnis Scientia (talk) 13:59, 8 January 2024 (UTC)

• Rename to {{cl|Works by Tyla (South African singer)}}. Doesn't warrant an WP:EPONCAT, but fits in the {{cl|Works by South African musicians}} tree. --woodensuperman 16:27, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

:: But the tours and files aren't works, so pruning would be needed. Take those away though and a "works by" parent isn't even necessary. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 17:28, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

:::Yes, sure, it would need pruning, but it would still hold three subcats. --woodensuperman 15:02, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

::@Marcocapelle, @Omnis Scientia, any thoughts on renaming? Qwerfjkltalk 19:38, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

• {{ping|Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars}} you might want to withdraw this nomination and start a new one including the subcategories. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:42, 14 January 2024 (UTC)
• :I would be in favor deleting the whole tree. They are all too small. @Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars, start a new one as Marco says. Omnis Scientia (talk) 14:15, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
• :: I'm OK with closing this as no consensus. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 20:18, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
• Delete Really the biography article and the tour ones are the only potential direct content. (I would also favor deleting the tour subcat until if/when more articles appear.) No objection to creating a Works by Tyla category but that can be done outside of CFD. - RevelationDirect (talk) 12:21, 15 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:36, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Lists of women government ministers by country to :Category:Lists of female government ministers by country

:Nominator's rationale: Every content uses "female", not "women". —Panamitsu (talk) 20:53, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

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::Oppose. The parents all use women. See :Category:Women government ministers by country Mason (talk) 19:42, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

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:Oppose per Smasongarrison. --AlexandraAVX (talk) 23:40, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:36, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Lists of women government ministers by portfolio to :Category:Lists of female government ministers by portfolio

:Nominator's rationale: Every content uses "female" not "women" —Panamitsu (talk) 20:55, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

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::Oppose. The parents all use women. See :Category:Women government ministers by country Mason (talk) 19:44, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

:::But all the contents use "female", such as List of female defence ministers. This is quite similar to WP:C2D. —Panamitsu (talk) 21:30, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

:::* It is clearly a conflict between C2D and C2C. To me it would make more sense to rename the articles, since we obviously have no children in these lists. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:22, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:09, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Wikipedia categories named after writers}}

:Nominator's rationale: I fail to see how this category isn't 100% redundant to :Category:Writers, basically even copying eevery subcategory in its tree. Isn't this just pointless redundance? Adam Cuerden ^(talk)_{Has about 8.7% of all FPs.} 02:27, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

::Oppose. These are maintenance categories for eponymous categories. Mason (talk) 05:55, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

:::Yes, but it's a complete redundant copy of the category tree for Writers, and I can't see any use. What on earth is this maintaining? Adam Cuerden ^(talk)_{Has about 8.7% of all FPs.} 08:04, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

::Oppose; it clearly says this is a maintenance category. Omnis Scientia (talk) 09:48, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

• I guess the original intention was that biography categories shouldn't contain any eponymous subcategories because these subcategories do not contain biographical articles. But this is not maintained, not even documented as a guideline as far as I know. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:09, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

:* {{ping|Timrollpickering}} do you know more about the history of this? Marcocapelle (talk) 10:03, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:09, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Prada exclusive models to :Category:Models (profession)

:Nominator's rationale: Non-defining intersection between brand and occupation Mason (talk) 01:46, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

• Support in principle in the spirit of WP:OCAWARD, but just delete because the articles are already in a models by nationality subcategory. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:12, 28 December 2023 (UTC)
• Comment if it's to be merged anywhere it might as well be merged into :Category:Prada. Trillfendi (talk) 16:25, 28 December 2023 (UTC)
• :This would be inappropriate due to WP:COPSEP. --woodensuperman 16:30, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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• Delete: parallel with WP:PERFCAT --woodensuperman 16:30, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:38, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Members of the Galizien division to :Category:Members of the Galicia Division

:Nominator's rationale: WP:COMMONNAME: this is the most common short name for the division,[https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=Galicia+Division%2CGalician+Division%2CGalizien+Division%2CDivision+Galicia%2CDivision+Galician%2CDivision+Galizien&year_start=1978&year_end=2019&corpus=en-2019&smoothing=3&case_insensitive=true][https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=Galicia+Division%2CGalician+Division%2CGalizien+Division%2CDivision+Galicia%2CDivision+Galician%2CDivision+Galizien&year_start=1987&year_end=2019&corpus=en-2019&smoothing=3&case_insensitive=true] capitalized as a proper name. The short name is appropriate as this category includes members both while it was the 14th Waffen Grenadier Division of the SS (1st Galician) (1943–45) and 1st Galicia Division of the Ukrainian National Army (1945).  —Michael Z. 15:56, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

::Google Scholar results:

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Galicia+Division%22&btnG= "Galicia Division"] 370

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Division+Galizien%22&btnG= "Division Galizien"] 250

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Division+Galicia%22&btnG= "Division Galicia"] 241

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Galician+Division%22&btnG= "Galician Division"] 121

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Galizien+Division%22&btnG= "Galizien Division"] 69

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Division+Halychyna%22&btnG= "Division Halychyna"] 68

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Halychyna+Division%22&btnG= "Halychyna Division"] 57

::* [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22Division+Galician%22&btnG= "Division Galician"] 23

:: —Michael Z. 16:47, 20 December 2023 (UTC) Added more results. —Michael Z. 04:16, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

• Comment "Galacia" is the English word for this region. Peterkingiron (talk) 19:05, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
• :Galicia is English (not Galacia); galizien is German.  —Michael Z. 04:13, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

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• Support per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:50, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
• Apologies for my misspelling. Peterkingiron (talk) 17:08, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:39, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Assassinated businesspeople to :Category:Businesspeople

:* Propose merging :Category:Assassinated Turkish businesspeople to :Category:Turkish businesspeople

:Nominator's rationale: Non-defining intersection between occupation and manner of death. If kept, should be renamed Murdered businesspeople. Mason (talk) 15:20, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

::Delete All members are likely already in another subcategory. Most were murdered for reasons unrelated to their jobs. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 03:32, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

• Rename :Category:Assassinated businesspeople to :Category:Murdered businesspeople, re-parent, and merge the Turkish subcat into it. This sounds like an acceptable intersection. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:45, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
• Keep. Perfectly normal category within parent :Category:Assassinated people by occupation. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 09:06, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
• :@Piotrus can you talk some more about why businesspeople are a perfectly normal category for assassination as opposed to being murdered? Mason (talk) 21:13, 5 January 2024 (UTC)
• ::@Mason I don't see what makes them different from others (activists, cartoonist, mass media people or others in :Category:Assassinated people by occupation). For some it can be quite defining - people get assassinated by business rivals, for example, or for being connected to politics and crime while being primarily seen as businessmen. Consider for example Suspicious deaths of Russian businesspeople (2022–2023), Boris Berezovsky (businessman) or Brett Kebble. That said, I also support creation of parent :Category:Murdered businesspeople (ex. for Paul Massey (gangster)) as suggested above. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 01:34, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
• Keep, nothing wrong with this category. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcelus (talk • contribs) 09:48, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

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• Keep I agree with Piotrus. Dimadick (talk) 13:25, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

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::Either keep this category, or rename to :Category:Murdered businesspeople. Strongly oppose deleting or merging this category. AHI-3000 (talk) 22:05, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Upmerge the Turkish sub-cat. –Aidan721 (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:40, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose splitting :Category:7th-century Arabian Jews to :Category:Arabian Jews and :Category:7th-century Jews

:Nominator's rationale: I don't think that this specific ethnic group needs to be diffused by century Mason (talk) 03:31, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose, these are Jews who are almost exclusively mentioned in the Quran. This is a distinct group of articles. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:22, 20 December 2023 (UTC)
• :In that case, I think the category should be renamed to capture that defining feature. Mason (talk) 14:27, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

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::What about :Category:Arabian Jews that interacted with Muhammad, modeled off of :Category:Arabian tribes that interacted with Muhammad? Mason (talk) 21:12, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::* A few did not interact with Muhammad but with his successor. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:55, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

::*:Ok... do you have an alternative suggestion that captures the defining feature? I think that we shouldn't have the "century" element in the same as it isn't a defining feature. Mason (talk) 22:03, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: keep and build out hierachy. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 16:35, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:Centuries in the Province of Massachusetts Bay}} to : Category:Centuries in Massachusetts

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:Decades in the Province of Massachusetts Bay}} to : Category:Decades in Massachusetts

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:Years in the Province of Massachusetts Bay}} to : Category:Years in Massachusetts

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:Disestablishments in the Province of Massachusetts Bay by century}} to : Category:Disestablishments in Massachusetts by century

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:Establishments in the Province of Massachusetts Bay by century}} to : Category:Establishments in Massachusetts by century

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:Disestablishments in the Province of Massachusetts Bay by decade}} to : Category:Disestablishments in Massachusetts by decade

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:Establishments in the Province of Massachusetts Bay by decade}} to : Category:Establishments in Massachusetts by decade

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:18th century in the Province of Massachusetts Bay}} to : Category:18th century in Massachusetts

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:18th-century disestablishments in the Province of Massachusetts Bay}} to : Category:18th-century disestablishments in Massachusetts

:* Propose merging {{lc|Category:18th-century establishments in the Province of Massachusetts Bay}} to : Category:18th-century establishments in Massachusetts

:Nominator's rationale: WP:OVERLAPCAT. It is by no means useful to have navigation for pre-statehood and post-statehood Massachusetts be separated solely due to a difference in name. –Aidan721 (talk) 00:04, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

::Oppose. Province of Massachusetts Bay is not the same entity as Massachusetts (nor are they same as Massachusetts Bay Colony, Plymouth Colony, or Province of Maine). Each entity as it's own history and combining them into one category is anachronistic and simply creates a mess. They also do not overlap as each entity has its own years and area, so other than sharing a somewhat similar name, how do they overlap? Gonnym (talk) 00:08, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

:::On a related note, all changes to the categories should be restored to the status quo while this CfD is ongoing. Gonnym (talk) 00:11, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

• Reverse merge, to the entity that existed in that period. Nom is right that there shouldn't be two parallel trees. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:31, 20 December 2023 (UTC)
• :@Marcocapelle can you explain what the "reverse merge" here means? Gonnym (talk) 08:40, 20 December 2023 (UTC)
• :: I guess he means e.g. removing Province decade categories from :Category:Decades in Massachusetts. That parent currently holds a continuous series from Massachusetts Bay Colony (1620s–1680s) through Province of Massachusetts Bay (1690s–1780s) to Massachusetts (1780s–present). See Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2023_June_4#Years_in_Massachusetts for a more detailed history. – Fayenatic London 09:28, 20 December 2023 (UTC)
• :::Ok. If that is the case then restoring :Category:Decades in the Province of Massachusetts Bay to its non-redirect state, which was how it was before yesterday. Gonnym (talk) 10:41, 20 December 2023 (UTC)
• I think I see what has happened here. When I implemented the June 4 CFD,[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Contributions&end=2023-06-21&namespace=all&start=&tagfilter=&target=Fayenatic+london&offset=&limit=142] I redirected some template-generated parent categories, rather than build separate hierarchies for each historical period. E.g. as the Colony only existed within one century, there is no need for it to have a separate :Category:Decades in the Massachusetts Bay Colony. I also saw to the merger of C17 in Massachusetts into :Category:17th century in the Massachusetts Bay Colony. However, {{u|Aidan721}} and {{u|Gonnym}} considered that there was sufficient content to build out more of the categories for the Colony and the succeeding Province, and did so. Keep and build out the hierarchy, e.g. adding :Category:Years of the 17th century in the Province of Massachusetts Bay into :Category:Years in the Province of Massachusetts Bay, and split :Category:Years of the 18th century in Massachusetts to :Category:Years of the 18th century in the Province of Massachusetts Bay. – Fayenatic London 12:43, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• :Note, that regarding your commit that you deleted, I think part of the fact that I missed it has to do with the usage of {{tl|resolve category redirect}} which doesn't help when creating these trees as it doesn't show what the missing categories are. Gonnym (talk) 13:11, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• :: If you happen to look in :Category:Decades in Massachusetts, the Colony decades show up there, whereas the Province decades are now obviously missing/sub-catted, but I take your point. For another example, it was not obvious that :Category:Years of the 18th century in the Province of Massachusetts Bay is redirected. Do you have any suggestions about managing this? I don't even know if a PetScan could be written to find such cases affecting a hierarchy. – Fayenatic London 22:01, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• :::Yes. Remove {{tl|resolve category redirect}}} which is misused here as it obstructs the automatic red-link categories that should be created. Gonnym (talk) 10:27, 24 December 2023 (UTC)
• ::::Sorry Gonnym, I don't agree with that proposal. In very many cases resolving redirects is helpful, e.g. :Category:Decades in Burkina Faso should not be split to :Category:Decades in Upper Volta. There are many cases where using the subcat name all the way up would result in a tiny category hierarchy that would not be useful for navigation. However, I accept that I should have created a hierarchy here rather than merging them using redirects. – Fayenatic London 22:44, 28 December 2023 (UTC)
• :::: Gonnym this is a courtesy ping about Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2023_December_30#History_of_Ceylon_by_period where I propose to make extensive use of resolving such category redirects. – Fayenatic London 16:44, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
• Comment -- This is a case where governmental changes have meant that WP creates multiple successive categories for what is in fact much the same place. The province was created in 1691, but the merger of several preceding colonies, particularly Plymouth Bay, after the dissolution of the short-lived (and opposed) Dominion of New England. On the other hand, MASS lost control of what is now Nova Scotia and New Brunswick to the French. Maine became a separate state in 1820. To some extent this is about how we parent specific categories. I would suggest we have a single tree for Colonial MASS, which may parent sibling Plymouth Bay and Massachusetts Bay categories. We have had a similar problem over modern states that have changed name, where the parent for the modern name includes categories related to its preceding identities. Peterkingiron (talk) 19:24, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

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::@Qwerfjkl can we stop with the relisting? There is no arguments and from reading this, Marcocapelle, Fayenatic London and myself are all in agreement. Gonnym (talk) 15:49, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

:::@Gonnym really? I don't see that. Qwerfjkltalk 16:02, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::::@Qwerfjkl Fayenatic said to {{tq|Keep and build out the hierarchy}}, which is the current tree with fixes, which I agree with. Marcocapelle said {{tq|Reverse merge}} which Fayenatic explained is moving the Province categories from the state tree to their own tree, which is the same as what Fayenatic said. Gonnym (talk) 16:26, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:10, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Multi-purpose stadiums in the Americas}}

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Sports venues in the Americas}}

:Nominator's rationale: Not useful. Same rationale of many "Americas" categories that have been deleted. –Aidan721 (talk) 14:51, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::Support per nom as the child categories are already in the correct "by continent" category. Mason (talk) 21:09, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Delete, the subcategories are already siblings in the by-continent tree. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:06, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: speedy delete per WP:CSD#G4. ✗plicit 14:56, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Vegetarian}}

:Nominator's rationale: WP:NOTDEFINING. –Aidan721 (talk) 14:25, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:34, 5 January 2024 (UTC)
• Speedy delete per WP:CSD#G4 - already deleted at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2013 May 8#Category:Vegetarians. --woodensuperman 14:42, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge/delete.

• Merge :Category:Politicians born in Kocaeli to :Category:People from İzmit
• Delete :Category:Politicians by provinces of Turkey (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:13, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Politicians born in Kocaeli}}

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Politicians by provinces of Turkey}}

:Nominator's rationale: "Born in" is not defining in this context. When it comes to politicians, the defining geographic intersection is not where they were born, it's where they did politics. Bearcat (talk) 14:29, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

• Delete. Useless categories, also instances of WP:NARROWCAT and WP:OCLOCATION. Deltaspace⁴² (talk • contribs) 14:38, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
• Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:38, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
• :Delete per nom Mason (talk) 20:46, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
• Merge first to :Category:People from Kocaeli. The current category is too specific. Peterkingiron (talk) 18:07, 26 December 2023 (UTC)
• Merge the first to :Category:People from Kocaeli (none of the nominated articles are already in that category); delete the second per above. HouseBlaster^talk 17:17, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
• :@HouseBlaster, @Peterkingiron, :Category:People from Kocaeli is a redirect to :Category:People from İzmit. I assume you mean merge to that? Qwerfjkltalk 16:47, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
• ::Correct. Thanks for catching that! HouseBlaster^talk 17:09, 2 January 2024 (UTC)

:

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Relisting comment: This has been open and stalled for a few days now so I decided to relist which I hope is the right course of action.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Omnis Scientia (talk) 13:49, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Merging to :Category:People from İzmit is a reasonable alternative. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:59, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:14, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:1990s massacres in Algeria to :Category:Massacres during the Algerian Civil War

:Nominator's rationale: rename per List of massacres during the Algerian Civil War and there is not a set of massacres in Algeria by decade. This was opposed for speedy. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:43, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

{{Cot|copy of speedy discussion}}

• :Category:1990s massacres in Algeria to :Massacres in the Algerian Civil War - main article is titled List of massacres during the Algerian Civil War AHI-3000 (talk) 06:51, 3 January 2024 (UTC)
• :Oppose. This is part of a set of massacres by decade Mason (talk) 23:12, 3 January 2024 (UTC)

{{Cob}}

: {{ping|AHI-3000|Smasongarrison}} pinging contributors to speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:49, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::Weak Oppose. There are numerous countries in Category:Massacres in the 1990s Mason (talk) 21:08, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::* {{ping|Smasongarrison}} there are a few more, but they are likewise named e.g. :Category:Massacres in the Bosnian War. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:59, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

::Support, see my reasoning in the speedy discussion. AHI-3000 (talk) 21:23, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Rename per nom. –Aidan721 (talk) 17:12, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:16, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Cemeteries in the District of Columbia to :Category:Burial monuments and structures in Washington, D.C. and :Category:Cemeteries in the United States by state

:Nominator's rationale: dual merge, redundant category layer with only one subcategory. A speedy downmerge proposal was opposed. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:07, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

{{Cot|copy of speedy discussion}}

• :Category:Cemeteries in the District of Columbia to :Category:Cemeteries in Washington, D.C. – C2B. –Aidan721 (talk) 19:10, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

:Oppose Washington, D.C. and the District of Columbia have not always been coterminous. There really needs to be a full discussion of these renamings. Jahaza (talk) 19:59, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

::You should have it, but the current consensus that it close enough for District of Columbia and :Category:District of Columbia to redirect to it. This oppose should be disregarded as it's basically against community consensus and the opposer isn't actually going to start the discussion either. Gonnym (talk) 13:28, 4 January 2024 (UTC)

{{Cob}}

: {{ping|Aidan721|Jahaza|Gonnym}} pinging contributors to speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:13, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::Merge per nom. Omnis Scientia (talk) 17:39, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Merge. –Aidan721 (talk) 14:05, 5 January 2024 (UTC)
• :Support merge per nom. Mason (talk) 21:04, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 19:36, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Subordinators by language to :Category:Subordinators

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Declarative subordinators}} added 12/22

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Interrogative subordinators}}

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge as this entire category tree is a mess. Mason (talk) 23:26, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge for now. Unhelpful for navigation to only have one page in here Mason (talk) 15:16, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

::Now it has two. Brett (talk) 16:19, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

:::Great! But that doesn't fix the other problem that the parent category only has this category in it. Mason (talk) 02:21, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

::::Now it too has two. Brett (talk) 12:11, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

• Merge per nom, two redundant category layers on top of each other. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:47, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
• Keep. Has obvious potential to grow. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 09:08, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
• Keep. What Piotrus says. -- Hoary (talk) 22:32, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
• Keep. --Brett (talk) 23:43, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
• :Creating categories with single items does not solve the problem. @Brett why are you making categories with singles page in them? like, :Category:Interrogative subordinators and :Category:Declarative subordinators. This entire category scheme is a mess. Can someone (@Piotrus or @Hoary) please explain what the growth potential is? Mason (talk) 16:51, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• ::There are many other languages, thus the potential for Romanian interrogative subordinators, Ojibwa interrogative subordinators, etc. Brett (talk) 16:55, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• :::But they don't exist right now. Potential for growth is not a metric used for evaluating categories (small cat no longer exists as a policy). Mason (talk) 18:20, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• ::Mason, your nomination read(s): Upmerge for now. Unhelpful for navigation to only have one page in here. Seems pretty reasonable. But by the time I noticed the existence of this little discussion, the category already had two pages. So your nomination, however reasonable and constructive, seemed obsolete when I first read it. Now you're asking about the creation of single-item categories. The question's reasonable enough, and arguably {{U|Brett}} was a naughty fellow for perpetrating just such a category. (Without thinking too deeply about the matter, I have a mixed opinion.) But I wonder why you're bringing up the matter here and now. If what you're now proposing is (i) that the entire category scheme is a mess plus (ii) some better alternative, then please make this explicit. -- Hoary (talk) 23:10, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• :::Thanks for explaining your reasoning, that's helpful. I was asking because I didn't understand how potential for growth was related to the fact that this category is unhelpful for navigation. I think that both :Category:Interrogative subordinators and :Category:Declarative subordinators, should be deleted and that :Category:Subordinators by language should be merged into the parent. I've updated the nomination Mason (talk) 23:24, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
• ::::@Brett@Marcocapelle@Piotrus, I've updated the nomination per @Hoary's request. Mason (talk) 23:31, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

• ::::One thing about the directory tree that clearly is not satisfactory as it stands is that :Category:Declarative subordinators currently has but one member, That. The band-aid/elastoplast solution would be to hurriedly add the stub for a second. I'm not offering to do this -- not just because I loathe stubs, but because the article That, for starters, currently lacks a single mention of "subordinator" (even though, yes, it is a prototypical subordinator, for which please see The Cambridge Grammar of the English Language, passim). If the article were decent, its terminology could easily be updated. However, its section "Modern usage" is worthless. For me, fixing misinformation is more pressing than adding more information (let alone worrying about categorization). (Oh, and also, that "is not a thing": there are two {{Angbr|that}} {{IPA|/ˈðæt/|lang=en}} homonyms, as far apart from each other as Galicia is from Galicia.) -- Hoary (talk) 00:48, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
• Also support deletion of the two added categories, they are currently not helpful for navigation either. Possibly merge them to :Category:English grammar. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:43, 23 December 2023 (UTC)

:

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 18:59, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

:

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 12:02, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:19, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Harbourmasters of Australia to :Category:Australian harbourmasters

:Nominator's rationale: rename, we categorize people who went to Australia as Australians, even if they were not born there. This was opposed for speedy. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:03, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

{{Cot|copy of speedy discussion}}

• :Category:Harbourmasters of Australia to :Category:Australian harbourmasters – C2C: parent is Australian people by occupation Mason (talk) 16:21, 27 December 2023 (UTC)
• :Parent may be incorrect. The category is of harbormasters in Australia, but not all of them were Australian. Jahaza (talk) 03:44, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

{{Cob}}

: {{ping|Smasongarrison|Jahaza}} pinging contributors to speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:46, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::Support rename. Thanks for making the nom. Mason (talk) 21:03, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::support as long as the spelling remains the same JarrahTree 09:56, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

• Rename per nom. –Aidan721 (talk) 17:12, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Seawolf35 ^T--C 15:30, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Top Chef contestants}}

:Nominator's rationale: Textbook WP:PERFCAT. These people are notable for being chefs. --woodensuperman 09:59, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:05, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: soft delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:20, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Alpha Phi Omega members}}

:Nominator's rationale: Membership in Alpha Phi Omega is not a determining condition. Naraht (talk) 08:38, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

:*Comment This category is empty. Next time, just tag it CSD C1 as an empty category and it will be deleted after a week. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 19:12, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

::*Understood.Naraht (talk) 19:45, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: dual merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:26, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose splitting :Category:Latin panegyrists to :Category:Panegyrists and :Category:Ancient Roman poets

:Nominator's rationale: Dual merge as there is only one person in here, and there's no need to diffuse by genre. Mason (talk) 04:19, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Dual merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:31, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete :Category:Albanian people by municipality. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 19:34, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:People from Albania by municipality to :Category:Albanian people by municipality

:Nominator's rationale: Overlapping category Mason (talk) 04:09, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Reverse merge to the older page and possibly rename that one. I will tag that page too. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:34, 5 January 2024 (UTC)
• :Even better! Mason (talk) 23:53, 5 January 2024 (UTC)
• Comment :Category:Albanian people by municipality has been emptied which I guess just involved removing the category you're trying to get rid of. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:16, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
• :@Marcocapelle did this out of process with this edit. Qwerfjkltalk 18:26, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
• :* That is to avoid that :Category:People from Albania by municipality is orphaned when :Category:Albanian people by municipality ceases to exist. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:00, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
• :*:@Marcocapelle, please leave this to the closer, there's not much point in having a discusion if you're going to implement the closure beforehand. Qwerfjkltalk 19:34, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge to :Category:Fictional doves and pigeons. (non-admin closure) Seawolf35 ^T--C 15:35, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Fictional Columbidae}}

:Nominator's rationale: There is also :Category:Fictional doves and pigeons, which is the same thing. Kk.urban (talk) 03:43, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Merge to :Category:Fictional doves and pigeons per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:40, 5 January 2024 (UTC)
• :Merge to :Category:Fictional doves and pigeons. AHI-3000 (talk) 21:28, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:24, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:People from Garmen to :Category:People from Blagoevgrad Province

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge for now. This is the only category in the People by municipality in Bulgaria tree. And it only has 1 page in it, which is unhelpful for navigation Mason (talk) 03:36, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:42, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:24, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Gang members by location to :Category:Gang members

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge for now. There's only one category in here, which isn't helpful for navigation Mason (talk) 03:28, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:43, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete/merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:22, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Cambodian people by occupation and location to :Category:Cambodian people by location

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge/rename. this category right now only has one category in it which isn't helpful for navigation. Rename this category as there isn't a Cambodian people by location category Mason (talk) 01:15, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Just delete including its subcategories. These are unnecessary container levels, as ultimately there is only :Category:Sportspeople from Phnom Penh that contains articles. I will tag the subcategories too. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:49, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting :Category:Cambodian sportspeople by location

:* Propose deleting :Category:Sportspeople by city in Cambodia

• Agree in principle with Marcocapelle, but would suggest: –Aidan721 (talk) 14:09, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Sportspeople by city in Cambodia to :Category:Cambodian sportspeople and :Category:Sportspeople by populated place

::* Ah ok that is correct. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:45, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 18:21, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Bulgarian people by occupation and location to :Category:Bulgarian people by location

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge for now. There is only one2 categories in here, which is unhelpful for navigation Mason (talk) 01:10, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:54, 5 January 2024 (UTC)

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