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Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2025 May 20#Template:Strip nomobile

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=[[Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2025 May 20|May 20]]=

== [[Template:Strip nomobile]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Strip nomobile}}

This hack lets navboxes be read on mobile, however, in every single case this was used in an article, the article reading experience is worse than with a standard table, and since references are never used in navboxes, then using these in articles leads to a giant block of unsourced data. Delete template and remove usages of navboxes mid-article, where used. Gonnym (talk) 13:59, 13 May 2025 (UTC)

  • Delete per nom. The whole work around the WMF until it works just plainly sucks. Izno (talk) 18:39, 13 May 2025 (UTC)
  • Keep, possibly restricting to non-mainspace with {{tl|main other}}. The template has been used poorly, but it also has legitimate use-cases{{snd}}it's a tool like {{tl|strip categories}}. jlwoodwa (talk) 23:05, 13 May 2025 (UTC)
  • :This template simply isn't necessary outside of (our) mainspace; the relevant code rips out content with certain classes (nomobile, navbox, vertical-navbox) only in content namespaces, of which we have only one: main. Izno (talk) 23:11, 13 May 2025 (UTC)
  • ::Page creator here. Your statement doesn't seem to be correct as the [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Alexis_Reggae/Strip_nomobile_test demo] linked in the documentation is in User: namespace. And it's legitimately used in that namespace:
    {{quote|1=This is a local userspace copy of the code used by Template:Strip nomobile, which as of the time I am writing this page, is at risk of deletion. As my userpage relies on the existence of this code for its functionality on mobile (specifically with User:NegativeMP1/Contributions box), I have archived it here for my own personal use.|author=NegativeMP1|source=User:NegativeMP1/nomobile}}
    It can also be useful for testing purposes. Keep. — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 02:16, 14 May 2025 (UTC)
  • :::The relevant code:
  • :::* [https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/g/mediawiki/extensions/MobileFrontend/+/2f74c9475de228ea3860309804dfdcd99942d5e2/extension.json#589 here is the default setting for RemovableClasses].
  • :::* [https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/g/operations/mediawiki-config/+/7c53e6a2e268fb7babc2181d528c1953fb59f4ac/wmf-config/InitialiseSettings.php#7252 here is the same setting fleetwide] (no material difference)
  • :::* [https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/g/mediawiki/extensions/MobileFrontend/+/2f74c9475de228ea3860309804dfdcd99942d5e2/includes/ExtMobileFrontend.php#137 actual code removing the content from being delivered down the pipe].
  • :::The reason why it is not present on that page is instead [https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/g/mediawiki/skins/MinervaNeue/+/3683218265beec291bb96a8cfe589f34d513c441/resources/skins.minerva.styles/content/main.less#38 simple CSS] hiding the content. And indeed, in the rendered page of interest is 
     ...
    In namespaces other than the main namespace, simple TemplateStyles can be used to unhide the relevant content, whether exploratory or otherwise.
  • :::I was precise in what I said regarding where MobileFrontend removes this content. Izno (talk) 02:37, 14 May 2025 (UTC)
  • ::::It's been a while so thanks for refreshing my memory. Using TemplateStyles does bring some complications. It seems you can't create the needed .css in userspace:
    {{tq|Page User:Alexis Jazz/Nomobile.css must have content model "Sanitized CSS" for TemplateStyles (current model is "CSS"). Changing the content model can be requested using {{tl|edit interface-protected}} on the talk page.}}
    Beyond that, if you were to use TemplateStyles to force-display nomobile, if I'm not mistaken, it would render all elements with nomobile visible on that page, not just the ones you actually want. This could be solved with the introduction of some new class with the end result being that usage will be so cumbersome it'll require a template. And that TemplateStyles would have to do something like .nomobile{display:unset !important} or .nomobile{display:block !important}, but to the best of my knowledge such a solution overrides what nomobile does, whereas {{tl|strip nomobile}} actually removes the nomobile class from whatever it encapsulates. If you want display to be what it would be if there was no nomobile class, frankly I wouldn't know how to make that happen using TemplateStyles. But if that is possible, I'd appreciate being enlightened. — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 03:30, 14 May 2025 (UTC)
  • Keep, it's not just navboxes but also useful templates like {{tl|Life timeline}} that require {{tl|Strip nomobile}} to be displayed in articles. And re: references, there's a way to do this in a P&G-compliant way by simply including a cite after the template for cases where all the info is cited to one source.

: I'm very interested in improving the article-reading experience, and would prefer to also have a template that converts navboxes to tables so we don't have to duplicate information. It's a relatively common practice to include navboxes in articles; see e.g. Mauritania at the Africa Cup of Nations#Squads, the issue is just in most of those cases the sections are completely unreadable on mobile. So while I agree using {{tl|strip nomobile}} sometimes isn't ideal and we should work on improving those articles, there are valid use cases and it's always better than having a blank page anyways. --Habst (talk) 00:19, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

::Life timeline probably doesn't need nomobile at this point. It was probably added there because collapsing wasn't supported by mobile, but it is now. Izno (talk) 00:43, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

:::Thanks, but as long as there are features that are locked out of the mobile view, there will always be a use-case for {{tl|strip nomobile}}. The specifics of which templates are using those features at the moment can change and doesn't really affect the core issue. --Habst (talk) 02:46, 18 May 2025 (UTC)

::::The core issue is that this template papers over what in most cases is an incorrect use of a template, categorically. The cited navboxes should {{em|not}} be used in the sections they are in, and that's {{em|the only case where this template is being used in mainspace}}.

::::There may be specific templates that need assistance, but what they definitely need is to ditch nomobile in most cases. Collapsing (or lack thereof) is no longer a sufficient reason to deny users access to whatever information, on {{em|any}} page, and not just the ones where someone has said "strip nomobile" should be employed here. So it goes for what I anticipate are most casual uses of the nomobile class. And separately, if any template is using one of the navbox classes and it's not derived from {{tl|sidebar}} or {{tl|navbox}}, it basically shouldn't be at this point (since {{em|I}} went through multiple years ago and {{em|removed}} classes used outside those templates). And uses otherwise are basically otherwise misuses of this {{tl|strip nomobile}}.

::::IOW, remove navbox/vertical-navbox where it appears outside the relevant templates, remove uses of templates that are being misused (as in the cited example above), and remove nomobile everywhere that isn't navbox related (with potential replacement with WP:TemplateStyles. This template is simply technical debt and should be deleted for that reason if no others.

::::It is currently used on only some [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=50&offset=0&ns10=1&ns828=1&search=insource%3Anomobile+-intitle%3A%2F%28%5C%2Fdoc%7C%5C%2Fsandbox%7CSandbox%7C%5C%2Ftestcases%29%2F+-insource%3A%2F%5BtT%5Demplate+display%5C%7Cnomobile%2F 50 templates and modules]. We can most assuredly get that down to many fewer.

::::I will add "remove nomobile" to MediaWiki talk:Common.css/to do regardless. There are a few templates/modules where it is appropriate and necessary and this workaround simply shouldn't exist for those cases anyway (navboxes/sidebars). Izno (talk) 04:42, 18 May 2025 (UTC)

:::::I agree it is in most cases incorrect. That isn't in conflict with a keep !vote, because if there is even one correct use-case, that case can be encouraged over incorrect ones. --Habst (talk) 13:47, 21 May 2025 (UTC)

  • delete, better to address this at a higher level. Frietjes (talk) 16:29, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

:

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 23:41, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

  • Delete per nom; it results in worse visual outcomes..! Vestrian24Bio 12:54, 23 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:Forever Knight]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Forever Knight}}

Three articles other than the subject, already sufficiently interlinked. WP:NENAN --woodensuperman 14:58, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

:*Keep, useful, give a quick overview of what Wikipedia has on the topic.

: Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 18:49, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

:* Delete Subject is sufficiently interlinked. Not a big enough spread to require a navbox. Andrzejbanas (talk) 17:32, 21 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:Siah Jamegan F.C. squad]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Siah Jamegan F.C. squad}}

Unused and blanked sports navigation template. Gonnym (talk) 11:38, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:SCOTUS Link CaseFinder]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|SCOTUS Link CaseFinder}}

Unused with the documentation showing that the links result in dead links. Gonnym (talk) 11:37, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:Recent AfDs/preload]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Recent AfDs/preload}}

Can't find this template used with an insource search and has no incoming links. Gonnym (talk) 11:35, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:PakistanCensusPop]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|PakistanCensusPop}}

Unused census related template. Gonnym (talk) 11:16, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:Infobox medal templates/sandbox2]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Infobox medal templates/sandbox2}}

stale sandbox from 2023. Gonnym (talk) 11:14, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

:Feel free to delete. -- Great Brightstar (talk) 11:28, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:Infobox German place/sandbox2]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Infobox German place/sandbox2}}

Stale sandbox from 2013. Gonnym (talk) 11:13, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:Korean age]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Korean age}}

Age template which isn't used other than in two old talk archives. Subst there and delete template. Gonnym (talk) 09:59, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== [[Template:Film date and age]] ==

  • {{Tfd links|Film date and age}}

Unused and absolutely pointless duplicate template. Film articles will never use this, as they {{em|only}} use {{tl|Film date}}. If changes are wanted, they should be proposed over there. Gonnym (talk) 09:46, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

== Template:Furry-con-list ==

  • {{Tfd links|Furry-con-list-start}}
  • {{Tfd links|Furry-con-list-entry}}

Single use templates only ever used for the associated lists at Furry convention. No other use for these templates. Jalen Barks (Woof) 03:24, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

  • Keep: The templates are also used on My Little Pony fan convention#Active events, created by {{user|GregariousMadness}} as of last month. Perhaps a rename to 'con[vention]-list-entry' or similar would be appropriate. The purpose of the templates was to remove duplicated and easy-to-mess-up markup required to display interleaved header rows and descriptions from Furry convention#Events, a layout which I was not able to find in existing templates at the time, and it still performs that function even if it was only used on one page. (I have however removed the width restriction intended to allow parallel display of images to the right from the start template, as it was causing overflow issues on Wikipedia's mobile skin, and most such images have now been moved - the default desktop skin also restricts width now.) GreenReaper (talk) 11:13, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
  • :I am not opposed to a rename to allow for inclusion across multiple convention lists and articles with lists (not just furry conventions). With the inclusion in the new article by Gregarious, the original purpose of the template now has room for expansion beyond this limited scope. Jalen Barks (Woof) 17:42, 20 May 2025 (UTC)