Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Skepticism

David Irving has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Z1720 (talk) 04:09, 16 February 2025 (UTC)

Syracuse University has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Z1720 (talk) 03:46, 19 February 2025 (UTC)

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The redirect [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:NOLABLEAK&redirect=no Wikipedia:NOLABLEAK] has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Anyone, is welcome to comment on this redirect at {{section link|1=Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2025 February 24#Wikipedia:NOLABLEAK}} until a consensus is reached. TarnishedPath^talk 12:52, 24 February 2025 (UTC)

File:Information.svg There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Attachment therapy#Requested move 19 February 2025 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. TarnishedPath^talk 09:59, 27 February 2025 (UTC)

Could somebody please assess if this is a C, B, or Good class article? Bearian (talk) 15:34, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

:I gave it a C. Good article assessments have a process which you must request here. Skyerise (talk) 15:55, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

Can someone please look at this draft and see if they agree with my judgment that it appears to be promotional by ufologists who think that Escamilla photographed UFOs rather than flying insects? Robert McClenon (talk) 03:09, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

:I left comment on the talk page of the draft. Sgerbic (talk) 04:02, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

The Irlen syndrome article could use some attention. It used to say the syndrome and its treatment are psuedoscience, and is being overhauled to say that it's legit. I don't have the patience or access to sources to investigate. GA-RT-22 (talk) 23:20, 24 March 2025 (UTC)

We do not have articles on the 1970 book Psychic Discoveries Behind the Iron Curtain or on the authors Sheila Ostrander and Lynn Schroeder. It is used in a few articles though - I just removed one mention in the now unrelated article Nikolai Aleksandrovich Kozyrev. It was a massively influential book and an extremely stupid, gullible and boring one. (I just finished reading it.) Who likes to write such articles? --Hob Gadling (talk) 14:45, 6 April 2025 (UTC)

:Articles where the book is used:

• Dimitri Devyatkin
• Pyramid power
• Pyramidology
• Telekinesis
• Kirlian photography
• Alexander Gurwitsch
• Semyon Kirlian

:--Hob Gadling (talk) 14:55, 6 April 2025 (UTC)

I have recently created this article. It concerns a "Mystery sound" (quoting from an [https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/mystery-sound-serbia-protest-sparks-sonic-weapon-allegations-2025-04-02/ actual Reuters headline]), a "creepy" sound (quoting from an [https://www.rferl.org/a/serbia-protests-demonstrators-sonic-weapon-sound-cannon-vortex-earshot-vucic-belgrage-novi-sad/33351909.html actual RFE/RL article]), "unidentified phenomenon", and "unidentified technology" (quoting from a [https://vreme.com/en/drustvo/peti-studentski-zahtev-detaljna-istraga-o-incidentu-15-marta/ reliable Serbian publcation]). There is speculation regarding a sonic weapon, and while the article at this time only covers the LRAD speculation, there also exist alternative theories: that an Active Denial System was used (in an [https://www.derstandard.at/story/3000000261800/schallkanone-was-ueber-den-einsatz-der-waffe-in-belgrad-bekannt-ist Austrian newspaper of record] and elsewhere), that a vortex ring gun was used (in [https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2025/03/17/footage-appears-to-show-sonic-weapon-used-serbia-protesters/ The Telegraph] and elsewhere), and that a mysterious low-frequency emitter was used for "sound manipulation" ([https://www.dw.com/en/did-serbia-use-a-similar-sound-cannon-to-romania-in-1989/a-71996623 Deutsche Welle]).There is also a quasi-official explanation, attributed to an intelligence agency, according to which the event was a mass panic incident (see [https://www.k1info.rs/vesti/politika/77644/ovo-je-prava-istina-o-zvucnom-topu-detaljna-analiza-sluzbi/vest this non-RS article]; covered as a [https://vreme.com/vesti/bia-odgovara-preko-tabloida-to-je-samo-masovna-panika/ story-about-a-story in a reliable news magazine]).

Is this topic within this WikiProject's scope? —Alalch E. 23:02, 10 April 2025 (UTC)

:Pinging a few active WikiProject participants (from Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism/Participants) who say they're interested in physics: {{ping|Autarch|Girth Summit|Chetvorno|Samwalton9}} Any comment on the sanity and encyclopedic appropriateness of this content would be really appreciated. —Alalch E. 23:14, 10 April 2025 (UTC)

::The article seems to be well-supported by mainstream RSs: Reuters, NPR, Barrons, BBC, The Guardian. I don't know anything about the Serbian sources but I think Vreme is a mainstream news magazine. The speculative aspects about the sound and its possible sources seem to be properly identified as such. Looks like a good article to me. --Chetvorno^TALK 04:09, 11 April 2025 (UTC)

::I don't have a strong opinion on this, but from a skim through the article and some of the sources, I don't see this as being particularly relevant to this Wikiproject - why are you asking, has someone raised questions about whether these types of sonic weaponry actually exist or are effective or something? Girth Summit _(blether) 15:01, 14 April 2025 (UTC)

:::I am asking because I saw that in a few articles that discuss the event, Havana syndrome was mentioned as having certain commonalities with what is reported. The Havana syndrome article is within the scope of this WikiProject, rated as "high importance". A [https://vreme.com/vesti/vreme-istrazuje-dementori-i-stampedo-u-kralja-milana/ Vreme article discusses the Havana syndrome in relation to the Belgrade event under the heading "Mysterious syndrome"], and [https://www.dw.com/en/serbia-protests-what-are-sonic-weapons/a-71960106 a DW article about the event also has a section about the Havana syndrome]. At the same time, the "sound cannon" speculation started exactly as connecting-the-dots speculation and is still speculation, with no hard evidence produced that a particular technological means was used to cause the stampede, relative to an explanation of the event as having a non-technology-based mechanism. Therefore, experts interviewed by the BBC ([https://www.bbc.com/serbian/articles/c5y27nz1gl7o/lat source]) state the following: {{blockquote|"It appears that the disturbing noise was produced by a powerful acoustic source, possibly an LRAD device, though other mechanisms are also possible," said Jürgen Altmann, a physics professor at TU Dortmund University, speaking to BBC.{{pb}}Many types of such weapons can generate intense sound at distances ranging from several hundred to a few thousand meters, Altmann added. He is the author of a study on acoustic weapons and their effects on humans.{{pb}}"To confirm what was used, visual identification of the sound source is necessary. Sounds and symptoms experienced by affected individuals must be thoroughly analyzed," Altmann emphasized.{{pb}}Sound strong enough to cause symptoms reported by many in Belgrade should be more prominent in recordings, noted Trevor Cox, a professor of acoustic engineering at the University of Salford in the UK.{{pb}}"If people experience ringing in their ears or a shift in hearing threshold—similar to the temporary hearing loss after leaving a nightclub—it indicates that the sound was loud enough to cause temporary hearing damage," Cox explained.{{pb}}"This is quite serious because it can become permanent," he warned.{{pb}}However, Cox cautioned that a "sonic weapon" may not have been used during the controversial incident in Belgrade.{{pb}}"Even if the sound was not strong enough to cause hearing damage, it could trigger a 'fight-or-flight' response and influence crowd behavior. Stress itself can also induce tinnitus (ringing in the ears)," he pointed out.{{pb}}(emphasis mine)}}

:::Jonathan M. Moore, the U.S. State Department official who was the coordinator of investigations into the Havana syndrome under Blinken says that he does not believe that a sonic weapon was used ([https://www.euronews.rs/srbija/politika/161855/na-tim-snimcima-ne-vidim-takvu-reakciju-dzonatan-mur-o-navodima-o-upotrebi-zvucnog-topa-na-protestu/vest source]). Chris Mattmann says that he doesn't think it was a sonic weapon ([https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHTEamwf4KY video]). Vreme states unequivocally that a panic incident occurred and discusses the "sound cannon" as something that could have caused the panic, but also does not discount panic as solely the mechanism, stating at that time that it is unknown where the panic came from ([https://vreme.com/vesti/vreme-istrazuje-dementori-i-stampedo-u-kralja-milana/ source]: {{tqq|The outbreak of mass panic followed by a stampede is not merely a theory but a fact. The only remaining question is whether the panic emerged out of nowhere and then spread through a butterfly effect.}}). It would subsequently become known where it emerged from ([https://vreme.com/vesti/ovo-je-mapa-huka-i-diverzije-u-kralja-milana/ source]; that's covered in our article, and there's video from the site where the panic came from as it was emerging).

:::The original quasi-official explanation was that the cause of the stampede was panic ([https://vreme.com/vesti/bia-odgovara-preko-tabloida-to-je-samo-masovna-panika/ source]). This quasi-official report was never announced as an official finding, and was instead syndicated to non-independent media outlets quite early on, obviously as an exercise in plausible deniability so as not to detract from potential future attempts to intentionally obfuscate facts and disseminate potentially more exploitable even if less truth-based narratives. This feels like a predictable strategy in light of the bizarre announcement that Russia's Federal Security Service had been, as it was claimed, invited to investigate. The panic explanation was swept under the rug and supplanted by an entirely outlandish and spurious ([https://n1info.rs/vesti/na-sajtu-bia-dokument-nepotpisan-fsb-ga-nije-objavio-kakva-je-verodostojnost-izvestaja-o-zvucnom-topu/ source]. [https://n1info.rs/vesti/otkud-srpsko-lj-u-ruskom-izvestaju-i-druge-nelogicnosti/ another], [https://www.danas.rs/vesti/drustvo/pravni-i-bezbednosni-strucnjaci-saglasni-izvestaj-fsb-nema-tezinu-lici-na-narucenu-propagandu/ another]) purported FSB report, according to which the event was caused by a "staged provocation" involving "synchronized movement" (cringe). —Alalch E. 03:08, 19 April 2025 (UTC)