talk:pitch (music)#Perception

The lede contains this sentence: "Pitch can be determined only in sounds that have a frequency that is clear and stable enough to distinguish from noise." Perhaps this is quoted from the referenced source, but "noise" is a problematic term: music often incorporates unpitched percussion, for example, which isn't really noise. The page noise defines it as unwanted sounds, like weeds in a garden, which is a value judgment more than a perceptual phenomenon. —Wahoofive (talk) 23:27, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

:How about this: "Pitch can be determined only in sounds that have a frequency that is clear and stable enough to distinguish from unwanted noise." Is that better? ➧datumizer  ☎  06:18, 4 March 2021 (UTC)

:It has nothing to do with "unwanted". Noise is a recognised technical term for non-periodic signals. It fits perfectly with unpitched percussion, which is certainly not unwanted. −Woodstone (talk) 07:38, 4 March 2021 (UTC)

:That whole sentence is nonsense (though it's cobbled, roughly, from a reliable source that's equally nonsensical). What does it mean for a sound to "have a frequency that is clear and stable..."? We're not talking about sinusoids here. Dicklyon (talk) 04:59, 8 October 2021 (UTC)

::While it may be closer to "physics for poets" than some might prefer, it is far from nonsense. "Clear" can be construed as closer to the "tuning fork" end of a spectrum whose other end is "sack of dented pots and pans rolling down a steep hill."

::"Stable" can be taken to mean "holding still long enough for a pitch to be identifiable," say, longer than several dozen milliseconds. Just plain Bill (talk) 17:11, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

I was hoping to find out when it became possible to associate a frequency with a pitch. The idea that sound is vibrations of air has been around for a very long time, but when did it become possible to associate an actual number of cycles per second to a pitch? BruceThomson (talk) 03:41, 8 October 2021 (UTC)

:According to [https://books.google.com/books?id=kebDOljfX7oC&pg=PA9&dq=%22frequency+corresponding+to+a+given+pitch%22&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj0rrvRgbrzAhWAqHIEHZSICOMQ6AF6BAgFEAI#v=onepage&q=%22frequency%20corresponding%20to%20a%20given%20pitch%22&f=false Beyer 1999] it was Marin Mersenne (1588–1648). Dicklyon (talk) 04:56, 8 October 2021 (UTC)

pitch is a perpetual property of sound

That allows their ording on an a frequency-related scale 102.89.34.202 (talk) 18:09, 22 October 2023 (UTC)

Rather than pitch being a synonym to frequency, it is instead a perceptual phenomenon? And each "pitch" (i.e. each perception of a sound) has an assosciated frequency? I am so vastly confused. How am I supposed to understand pitch if it's not objective? Qsimanelix (talk) 19:15, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

:It's a real problem, isn't it? Some other people have been troubled by such discrepancies throughout history. Remsense诉 19:35, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

::I'm trying to learn the basics of music right now, and this is not helpful. I need an explanation of music, for newbies like me. Qsimanelix (talk) 19:45, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

:::The article is not as good as it could be, but this is a real distinction that is important to make. I am not sure how it should be best presented, but remember that articles are meant for a general audience and not tailored how-to guides. I don't think we have an Introduction to music theory article, sadly. Remsense诉 19:50, 17 March 2024 (UTC)