Talk:Prince Inigo of Urach

{{requested move/dated|Inigo von Urach}}

:Prince Inigo of Urach → {{no redirect|Inigo von Urach}} – Not a prince, the notion he is a prince is entirely theoretical and to describe him as one is not neutral. D1551D3N7 (talk) 23:38, 5 March 2025 (UTC) — Relisting. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 23:13, 20 April 2025 (UTC)

• Oppose on the grounds that the requested move rationale is faulty. {{green|the notion he is a prince is entirely theoretical}} source? According to this [https://www.newsweek.com/royals-titles-monarchy-abolish-country-name-royalty-1744488 source], {{green|However, a general rule of etiquette is to refer to a royal by their titles, even if they have been deposed and their country does not recognize them or their hereditary appellations.}} I remember having a previous discussion on another requested move similar to this one about the same issue. Just because a monarchy is abolished does not mean that the former members lose their titles nessesarily. Now I am not sure if this entirely applies here, but the rationale to move this page is not strong enough to support it. It would be a different story if this was being requested based on Wikipedia policy, such as WP:COMMONNAME. cookie monster 755 09:45, 6 March 2025 (UTC)
• :The Kingdom of Lithuania (1918) is different to the much older Kingdom of Lithuania which ended in 1263.
• :It was barely established if you could consider it established at all, the proposed monarchy only existing from February 1918 to November 1918 in German occupied Lithuania.
• :Are we calling him Prince on the basis of the abolished German monarchy or the Lithuanian monarchy?
• :If its on the basis of the Lithuanian monarchy I find it ridiculous as even Wilhelm Karl, Duke of Urach doesn't have "King Mindaugas II" as his page title and he was actually alive for this short lived "monarchy".
• :If its on the basis of the German monarchy then it should be moved to make it consistent with other descendants of former German royal houses like Georg Friedrich Prinz von Preussen.
• :For WP:COMMONNAME the sources tend to be monarchist and have a bias for calling him such but he is not relevant enough to be discussed in more common news sources. D1551D3N7 (talk) 11:43, 6 March 2025 (UTC)
• ::If these "monarchist" sources are otherwise reliable secondary sources, and there are few if any others, then we should follow their usage. Andrewa (talk) 01:07, 13 March 2025 (UTC)

:Support, it's ridiculous that he is named "Prince" because grandfather was supposed to be a king, but never was. Marcelus (talk) 14:48, 6 March 2025 (UTC)

:Oppose - no policy basis for this move. estar8806 (talk) ★ 18:34, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

::WP:NPOV is a policy. D1551D3N7 (talk) 18:39, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

:::Prove that it's not neutral then, beyond just your opinion. estar8806 (talk) ★ 18:42, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

::::Exactly. WP:NPOV does apply here, but as no other rationale has been given for the move, it appears to me that the POV views here are those supporting the move. Andrewa (talk) 09:58, 13 March 2025 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME and POV nomination. -- Necrothesp (talk) 16:29, 11 March 2025 (UTC)
• Oppose. No policy-based rationale for this move has been given. Andrewa (talk) 01:11, 13 March 2025 (UTC)
• Support as the suggested target is closer to the common name. Web searches, for Inigo Urach without participles and therefore unbiased, demonstrate that the common name is his official name. The hits for Inigo of Urach are self-published genealogy websites, personal blogs, and social media posts. See [https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/officers/EE9NQi_wkoOcZfYcDRCdWIPps10/appointments][https://www.northdata.com/F%C3%BCrst%20von%20Urach%20Graf%20von%20W%C3%BCrttemberg,%20Inigo,%20Niederaichbach/11us][https://www.companyhouse.de/l/p/Inigo-Fuerst]. Whether or not he's a 'real' prince is largely irrelevant to deciding the article title. Celia Homeford (talk) 13:49, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
• Relisting comment Let's try to refocus this along the lines of Celia Homeford's comment rather than just "He's a prince" versus "He isn't a prince". * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 23:13, 20 April 2025 (UTC)
• Support to move to Inigo Urach, otherwise move to proposed name I just want to remind, that this is not a WP:VOTE. The relevant policy is the WP:COMMONNAME in WP:RELIABLE WP:SOURCES. --Theoreticalmawi (talk) 13:32, 26 April 2025 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. English sources seem to be very scant, but one I've found such as [https://vilnews.com/2013-05-19052] uses "Prince". The article's own sources are generally Lithuanian ones, but overall it seems like they use "Prince" as well in the title, e.g. [https://www.delfi.lt/news/daily/lithuania/lietuvos-karalyste-ne-tuscia-fantazija-64312066][https://www.moteris.lt/lt/mada/g-52988-lietuvos-karaliaus-mindaugo-ii-anuko-istorija-dvieju-kilmingu-jaunuoliu-meile-uzsimezge-ne-pilyje-o-kaip-ir-daugumos-kitu-jaunuoliu-turistiniame-zygyje][https://www.delfi.lt/archive/mindaugo-ii-anukas-jei-lietuviai-panores-atgaivinti-monarchija-esu-pasirenges-priimti-sia-garbe.d?id=61409369] have "Prince" at the beginning of the title. The links given above by Celia to Companies House entries and suchlike don't look like independent reliable sources that would give evidence to the contrary here. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 09:03, 29 April 2025 (UTC)

The article has multiple shortcomings in terms of verifiability and neutrality.

It mentions a "first official visit," which is an incorrect use of this term—Inigo von Urach, as a private individual with no public function, cannot make "official visits."

The article also refers to "Lithuanian monarchist organizations," whereas the sources cited mention only one: "Lietuvos karalystės rūmai" (Lithuanian Royal Palace), a small organization whose only known member and chairman, Stanislovas Švederas, received 232 votes in the Vilnius city council elections ([https://www.vrk.lt/savivaldybiu-tarybu-ir-meru-2023/rezultatai?srcUrl=/rinkimai/1304/1/1922/rezultatai/lt/rezultataiSavPartPirmBalsaiApg_rpgId-21928_rorgId-32208.html]). Moreover, the organization's website ([lkr.lt]) contains no content, only "Lorem ipsum." One may question whether this is truly a significant political movement or merely an initiative of a few individuals.

None of the sources, contrary to what is stated in the article, confirm that Inigo's brother is in a morganatic marriage. Furthermore, one source explicitly states that he is the primary owner of the family castle, which calls into question the description of Inigo as the head of the "House of von Urach"—a claim that is also unsourced. Marcelus (talk) 14:32, 13 March 2025 (UTC)