Talk:Settler colonialism#Removal of official UN source

Wait so was Arab expansion into North Africa/Maghreb and Iberia Settler colonialism? What happened to the Berbers and native Egyptians man? Alexysun (talk) 10:12, 28 January 2025 (UTC)

:I would consider it to be added; however, given current political views, most sources used terms such as “conquest”, or “expansion”. There seems to be a growing critique on Islamic/Arab colonialism; however, I think that we’re about a decade away from being able to discuss it with calm/academic eyes. Gesorgod (talk) 19:31, 4 April 2025 (UTC)

:They're still there, man. I think you're confusing Arabization with settler colonialism. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 19:35, 4 April 2025 (UTC)

I propose to merge Settler state into this article. The section Settler colonialism#Definition and concept already contains a definition. The article about state is pretty short and mostly contains information that already exists in this article. The settler state is very tightly related to settler colonialism. Викидим (talk) 08:55, 5 February 2025 (UTC)

:Support the other article incorrectly suggests that settler colonialism ends when settlers gain independence from the metropole. (t · c) buidhe 01:09, 6 February 2025 (UTC)

:Support for the same reasons mentioned by Викидим. Vacosea (talk) 00:38, 7 February 2025 (UTC)

:Support, as the concept is best covered here; there is no reason to have an effectively redundant separate article. Crossroads ^-talk- 22:43, 10 February 2025 (UTC)

:Oppose the other article is of low-quality and should be improved rather than merged. --Plumber (talk) 02:19, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

::A well-done merge would remove the low-quality text, so perhaps merge can be a welcome improvement? Викидим (talk) 02:25, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

:Oppose two very different academic disciplines..... with each having its own experts.Moxy🍁 02:39, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

::I am not an expert. Could you please elaborate on the particular disciplines? So far, the settler state seems to be an intermediate product of the settler colonialism (based on the text of the articles). Викидим (talk) 02:51, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

:::You could argue that there is an academic discipline of settler colonialism—however, it is pretty interdisciplinary, and still relatively niche. There is simply no such thing for "settler state", and unless Moxy provides some evidence it's not the case, the comment should be disregarded. (t · c) buidhe 05:12, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

::::[https://www.futurelearn.com/info/courses/indigeneity-as-a-global-concept/0/steps/203151 and for beginners] Moxy🍁 05:32, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

:::::This webpage distinguishes between the “regular” colonialism and the “settler” one. It does not, IMHO, make a distinction between settler colonies and settler states. Викидим (talk) 05:40, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

:::::The source doesn't say anything about any academic disciplines. (t · c) buidhe 06:17, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

:Support as, to me, the Settler state appears to be a specific example, possibly contrived by certain academics, of Settler colonialism. Combining the articles reduces the potential for a WP:POVFORK. Wikipedia articles should present a balanced view of a subject, particularly where academics have differing opinions. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 20:36, 15 February 2025 (UTC)

• Support; move settler state & its content to the Examples section and incorporate it there; replace #Examples with #Settler states. JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 23:37, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

:{{Strike|Oppose: They are related but separate things. A settler state is primarily born through settler colonialism. Meanwhile, a country can still engage in settle colonialism, even if said settler colonialism is not a major aspect of the nation's origin or creation. For instance, India has engaged in settler colonialism in Kashmir, but India itself is not a settler state EarthDude (talk) 19:46, 30 April 2025 (UTC)}}

:: Actually nevermind. I change my mind. Settler state's article has like three paragraphs and is actually quite niche. It should be merged to this article. EarthDude (talk) 19:51, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

:Support they seem to cover the same ground. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 21:10, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

• Comment I think 'propose' here is transitive, meaning "I propose to merge Settler State..." makes no sense. Would anyone object if the editor, User:Викидим, changed the wording? Roger 8 Roger (talk) 22:33, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

::That is well within what I would consider understandable English... If you really think it makes no sense then I would suggest that you lack the competence to communicate in colloquial English and should leave the project... But it think you're being hyperbolic, you don't actually mean that it makes no sense you mean that there is minor error which could be construed as changing the meaning if someone were ignorant, incompetent, or willfully obtuse. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 15:14, 9 May 2025 (UTC)

The article states,

"However, the opposite argument has also been made by Lorenzo Veracini, who argues that all genocide is settler colonial in nature."

Hitler's genocide of european jews clearly was not settler colonial in nature. Jews were not landowners. Hitler's genocidal conquest of Ukraine, on the other hand, clearly WAS settlercolonial in intention.

So the claim, "all genocide is settler colonial in nature" is clearly false. At best, "most genocides are settler colonial in nature". Thewolf37 (talk) 21:20, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

:This is an academic topic covered by many publications.... That is... the reference to colonialism and the Holocaust. {{cite book | last=Zimmerer | first=Jürgen | title=From Windhoek to Auschwitz?: Reflections on the Relationship between Colonialism and National Socialism | publisher=De Gruyter | date=2023-11-20 | isbn=978-3-11-075451-3 | doi=10.1515/9783110754513 | doi-access=free | url=https://www.degruyter.com/document/doi/10.1515/9783110754513/pdf | access-date=2025-03-03 | page=}} Moxy🍁 22:28, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

::Actually, the Holocaust was clearly a product of settler colonialism, as it involved the confiscation of Jewish homes, while others were deported eastward to "reservations" like in Lublin, Poland.

• [https://www.yadvashem.org/articles/academic/plunder-of-jewish-property-in-occupied-areas-of-soviet-union.html#:~:text=One%20of%20the%20by%2Dproducts,and%20plunder%20of%20their%20property. Plunder of Jewish Property in the Nazi-Occupied Areas Of the Soviet Union] by Yitzhak Arad.
• [https://alphahistory.com/holocaust/jewish-property-seizures/ Jewish property seizures]
• The American West and the Nazi East by Carroll P. Kakel III, p. 138, 173 and 188
• The Holocaust as Colonial Genocide by Carroll P. Kakel III
• The Lublin Reservation and the Madagascar Plan by Philip Friedman, p. 703 DaRealPrinceZuko (talk) 04:32, 9 May 2025 (UTC)

{{edit extended-protected|Settler colonialism|answered=yes}}

The Australian historian Patrick Wolfe, whose work is considered defining on the subject of settler colonialism, haz classified Israel as a modern form of settler colonialism.[11][15][7]

that should be changed to

The Australian historian Patrick Wolfe, whose work is considered defining on the subject of settler colonialism, has classified Israel as a modern form of settler colonialism.[11][15][7]

given that 'haz' is not a word, and clearly it should be 'has'

:) Majortomrade (talk) 18:54, 18 March 2025 (UTC)

{{done}} PianoDan (talk) 20:22, 18 March 2025 (UTC)

Would anyone like to add the colonialism sidebar template to the article? DaRealPrinceZuko (talk) 04:36, 9 May 2025 (UTC)