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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Antonio Capulín

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. The discussion tended towards delete, but I don't feel that consensus was reached here. The discussion didn't fully engage the issue as to the individual articles; not prejudice to a focused renomination as desired. Xymmax So let it be written So let it be done 15:08, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

=[[Antonio Capulín]]=

:{{la|Antonio Capulín}} – (View AfDView log)

:({{Find sources|Antonio Capulín}})

:{{la|Oscar Andrade}}

:{{la|Dennis Contreras}}

:{{la|Adrián Hernández (boxer)}}

:{{la|Carlos Gallegos}}

:{{la|David Cavita}}

:{{la|Rafael Ríos}}

:{{la|Luís David Serrano}}

:{{la|Daniel Hernández (boxer)}}

:{{la|Julio César Ávalos}}

:{{la|Adrían Granados}}

:{{la|Ignacio Esparza}}

All appear to fail WP:ATHLETE#Boxing Travelbird (talk) 09:43, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

  • Keep ALL The problem is not with these articles. The problem is with the boxing guidelines at WP:ATHLETE#Boxing. I've initiated a discussion on the talk page to get the guidelines changed so that these articles are not deleted. Some of these boxers are national champions and the others are all medallists at major national events.  Nipsonanomhmata  (Talk) 01:07, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

Comment When I nominated them, they did not yet have the info on having won national championships. This was added subsequently to the nomination. However most of them still only have claims to junior championship medals, which is definitely not enough on its own to establish notability.

At the moment:

  • Adrián_Hernández_(boxer) was NABF Light Flyweight champion, but according to WP:ATHLETE#Boxing this is not considered significant enough as the NABF is not one of the major world bodies.
  • According to information added subsequent to nomination, Ignacio Esparza did win the WBA Championship and thus should be kept.
  • All others online won/competed only at junior levels and thus are not notable on that basis alone. Travelbird (talk) 01:52, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

Delete ALL The argued reason for notability is based on amateur performance, not professional. WP:ATHLETE#Boxing does not apply to amateur notability, only professional (hence why under the 'Professional' heading). Clearly, based on their amateur accomplishments, these athletes do not meet WP:ATHLETE.

As a side, Ignacio Esparza did NOT win the WBA World Championship, but instead won a WBA regional belt (apparently the WBA Fedebol cruiserweight title). Thus should be deleted. RonSigPi (talk) 04:24, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

:Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 01:19, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

  • Comment Upon further review, WP:ATHLETE states that there are two ways sports figures are presumed notable (under Generally acceptable standards). The first prong is met by meeting any of the qualifications in one of the sports specific sections (such as WP:ATHLETE#Boxing). As my comment states above, the guidelines are only for professional boxers, thus the national amateur titles/medals you discuss are not relevant. However, there is a second prong is met by having participated in a major international amateur or professional competition at the highest level such as the Olympics. I believe competing at the World Amateur Boxing Championships would meet this prong. Many of the boxers you list are merely successful junior athletes to this point of their career. For example, Oscar Andrade was merely a cadet national champion (cadet is usually younger than junior, so probably age 16 and under) national champion. If any of these fighters won senior national championships for Mexico, then there is a good chance they fought at the World Amateur Boxing Championships and thus are notable. If you can establish that a fighter did fight at the World Amateur Boxing Championships, then that would save that article from deletion. However, merely winning a junior national medal (even gold) is well established in WP:ATHLETE as not being enough for notability.RonSigPi (talk) 14:40, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. -- -- Cirt (talk) 16:01, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete doing well at pre-adult levels isn't enough for notability. Olympians would be notable. The World Amateurs is a notch below and is an arguable case. MLA (talk) 10:18, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
  • Comment Why are you talking about "World Amateurs"? I took another look at all the articles listed above and they are undefeated PROFESSIONAL BOXERS with national titles. One of them was a reserve at the Olympic Games (when he was an amateur) since only amateurs can compete at the Olympic Games. Are you aware that your nomination will delete 12 boxing pro articles in one wholesale move?  Nipsonanomhmata  (Talk) 12:03, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.