Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Armenia–Japan relations

:{{la|Armenia–Japan relations}} ([{{fullurl:Armenia–Japan relations|wpReason={{urlencode: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Armenia–Japan relations}}&action=delete}} delete]) – (View AfD)(View log)

They've [http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0199-3841153/Japan-Armenia-agree-to-boost.html "agreed to boost dialogue"] (stop me if you've heard that one before), but show little evidence of meaningful interactions. Plus, no third-party sources actually deal with this relationship, meaning it fails WP:N. Armenian imports from Japan are $5.8 million and exports are $600,000; needless to say, that's not much in Armenia's $17 billion economy, and a mere accounting error in Japan's $4.3 trillion one. There's a tiny diaspora community, but even that has its own article, so there's no plausible reason to keep. Biruitorul ^Talk 20:01, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

• Comment I think its about time we came to a formal general consensus over whether these international relations articles meet requirements or not. Nobody would ever dream of deleting the US-UK relations article or the UK-Japanese relations article for instance. The problem lies in that different countries have differing levels of intergration. From a neutral viewpoint these international relations articles should be notable subjects. Unfortunately most were started without any real content. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 20:05, 8 May 2009 (UTC)
• There is an ongoing discussion here, but we know neither how long it will go on nor if it will achieve results. Of course no one would dream of deleting those two because [http://books.google.com/books?id=RQh6GCDmq4MC even] [http://books.google.com/books?id=jucqpxsTI6cC books] have been written specifically about those relations. For Armenia-Japan, that is simply not the case. - Biruitorul ^Talk 21:59, 8 May 2009 (UTC)
• I humbly proffer for your consideration ISBN 9994110101. Not that I can claim to have seen a copy. It's assuredly in Armenian and it appears that at least some of it is also in Japanese. Conceivably there's a little bit in English, too: it does appear to have a title in each of the three languages. -- Hoary (talk) 09:27, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• I believe it is not correct to assert that these bilateral relations articles have inherent notability. Even if we assume that Wikipedia, as a unique reference work, should include almanac-type entries, one still needs to establish the notability of the specific entry under consideration to decide whether it should be included or not. There are currently about 193 nations in the world, so unless it is being asserted that the 37,056 articles on bilateral relations between them are automatically notable, some evidence needs to be presented that each specific relationship is notable enough to warrant an article. Thus, no blanket decision can be made regarding them. Ed Fitzgerald _{t / c} 01:52, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
• Keep - Perhaps you missed some of the other articles. There are articles about actual "set in stone" agreements that have been signed. Take for example [http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_product=NewsLibrary&p_multi=BBAB&d_place=BBAB&p_theme=newslibrary2&p_action=search&p_maxdocs=200&p_topdoc=1&p_text_direct-0=0F97A75B9101F724&p_field_direct-0=document_id&p_perpage=10&p_sort=YMD_date:D&s_trackval=GooglePM], which states "Armenian Trade and Industry Minister Karen Chshmarityan and Chairman of the Japan International Cooperation Agency (JICA) Takao Kawakami signed a two-year programme on 'The development of Armenia's mining industry'". [http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_product=NewsLibrary&p_multi=BBAB&d_place=BBAB&p_theme=newslibrary2&p_action=search&p_maxdocs=200&p_topdoc=1&p_text_direct-0=0F97A76795F93179&p_field_direct-0=document_id&p_perpage=10&p_sort=YMD_date:D&s_trackval=GooglePM Another article] states, "Armenian Foreign Minister Vardan Oskanyan today held talks with Japanese Foreign Minister Makiko Tanaka. Vardan Oskanyan thanked the Japanese government for its continuous support for Armenia in areas such as the economy". There is also a nice circa 1920 New York Times article that discusses Japans recognition of Armenia[http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?_r=1&res=9C06E6D8103BEE32A25754C0A9659C946195D6CF]. Finally here is one last source [http://www.president.am/events/news/eng/?pn=81&id=45]. -Marcusmax(speak) 22:15, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

::1. There's a lot of Japanese money floating around. That some of it has made its way into the Armenian mining industry is neither surprising nor particularly significant - we're not told of an especially big impact on the Japanese economy from that deal.

::2. That's the same visit I pointed to. Yes, the President of Armenia once visited Japan. And...? Visits happen all the time; there's zero evidence this one had any impact beyond the week it happened and the headlines then generated.

::3. That Japan recognised the Democratic Republic of Armenia is noted in that article; to duplicate that content would be futile.

::4. Primary source, and anyway, receiving ambassadors is truly routine, and scraping the bottom of the "notability" barrel. We may as well recognise there isn't much here, and not strain to pretend there is. - Biruitorul ^Talk 23:29, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Japan-related deletion discussions. —Fg2 (talk) 01:05, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bilateral relations task force deletions. – Hoary (talk) 02:34, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Armenia-related deletion discussions. — Hoary (talk) 02:37, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• Keep If "there's a lot of J. money and some of it is going into A." there are significant relations between the two. The sources are enough to support an article. DGG (talk) 05:49, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• No, that is not the case. You might have declared that that constitutes evidence of notable relations, but your conclusion is not validated by sources discussing "Armenia–Japan relations", and thus breaches WP:PSTS. - Biruitorul ^Talk 14:37, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• Keep Per above. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 08:47, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• Keep If $5.8 million looks like a mere accounting error then I sincerely hope to be the beneficiary of the occasional mere accounting error. And there's an entire (if obscure) book devoted to the matter as well. -- Hoary 09:27, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• Now, now. The context was quite clear: compared to the Japanese GDP of $4.3 trillion, $5.8 million is indeed an accounting error. But the book makes me curious: is there a link to a record? - Biruitorul ^Talk 04:44, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
• Yup: see the article as I revised it: I provide the link to one record and invite readers to try feeding the ISBN to WorldCat (which has two records for it). [comment slightly revised after first posting] -- Hoary (talk) 16:35, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
• Keep. I believe that it's normal practice to keep articles on subjects about which whole books have been published, such as the one found by Hoary. Phil Bridger (talk) 22:15, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
• Keep - the Armenia PM stated "Armenia's authorities attach importance to consistent development of relations with Japan"[http://www.armeniadiaspora.com/ADC/news.asp?id=1698]. Smile a While (talk) 13:40, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
• Never mind that that source is self-published - what else was he going to say when receiving an ambassador? "Remember Pearl Harbor?" Friendly words spoken to a diplomat don't really constitute evidence of anything. - Biruitorul ^Talk 16:22, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
• Keep per the sources found by Marcusmax and these were English language sources alone. There's probably much more Japanese and Armenian sources. --Oakshade (talk) 16:47, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

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