Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/H.S.H. Princess Karina Bagration-Moukhransky

:{{la|H.S.H. Princess Karina Bagration-Moukhransky}} – (View AfDView log{{•}} {{plainlink|1=http://toolserver.org/~betacommand/cgi-bin/afdparser?afd={{urlencode:Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/H.S.H. Princess Karina Bagration-Moukhransky}}|2=AfD statistics}})

:({{Find sources|H.S.H. Princess Karina Bagration-Moukhransky}})

Non-encyclopedic article full of POV, personal opinion, and external links that do little to prove notability. Seems more like a resume than anything else. Jmlk17 16:53, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

• Delete, very little verifiable information here, and little evidence of coverage by reliable sources, despite rather extravagant claims in the article. A google search in Russian also shows almost nothing of relevance[http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=%22Карина+Багратион%22&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=]. Does not pass WP:BIO. Nsk92 (talk) 18:41, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ukraine-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 18:57, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 18:57, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

• Delete - The article subject might, and I do mean maybe, be notable, but the article in its current state is virtually beyond repair, and there is no evidence presented establishing notability. Unless it gets thoroughly rewritten and sourced it needs to go. - OldManNeptune (talk) 20:35, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Dear OldManNeptune, thank you for your oppinion.Could you please help a bit to fix the article?We also will be working on it more today to meet high standards of Wikipedia.Thank you very much —Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.73.13.200 (talk) 08:22, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

• Strong keep, with minor changes. The article is useful. Both Ukraine and Russia are flooded by fancy chivalry orders and nobility; it is very difficult to understand “who is who”. For notability visit the official site of Romanov family in exile. It’s in Russian and the lineage of Princess is there. http://geroldia.ru/?lang=rus&id=20 Sergeydancer (talk) 14:41, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

• The link you provided is to a directory listing of people with claims to titles of nobility. There is about half a sentence mention there of the subject of this article, as the wife of knyaz Dmitry Bagration-Mukhransky. The fact that she acquired by marriage the title of knyaginya, into one of hundreds of families of old Russian nobility, does not, in and of itself, make her notable. Russia abolished monarchy and titles of nobility almost a hundred years ago and having married a descendant of one of the numerous families of old Russian nobility is not noteworthy. The basic standard of notability on Wikipedia is to have received significant specific coverage by independent published reliable sources - see WP:BIO. There is little to show that such coverage is available here. Nsk92 (talk) 12:19, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
• A GoogleNews search[http://news.google.com/archivesearch?as_user_ldate=2000%2F01&as_user_hdate=2010%2F12&q=%22karina+bagration%22&scoring=a&hl=en&ned=us&q=%22karina+bagration%22&lnav=od&btnG=Go] returns a single hit, with only a brief mention of the subject. Nsk92 (talk) 13:18, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

Keep it..Bagration is actually the Royal House of Georgia, which does not make neither Dimitry. Every lady who married a royal prince(no matter if the house is ruling or not)is already special due to her position.Apparently Karina Bagration(which singles her out and which is clearly seen from the article)managed to do a lot of notable things in her life by herself.In Ukraine with the population of 45,888,000 she is the one like that. (Lys Flower) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.26.54.105 (talk) 13:59, 21 August 2010 (UTC)

:Monarchy in Georgia ceased to exist 200 years ago, when Georgia was absorbed into the Russian Empire, at which point Georgian nobility was incorporated into Russian nobility. According to the link provided by Sergeydancer above, Karina's husband Dmitry claims the title of knyaz because he is a distant descendant of the younger brother of Georgian king Vakhtang V who ruled eastern Georgia as a Persian vassal in mid 1600s. That may be of some interest to genealogy enthusisasts but it does not make Dmitry notable in the sense defined by Wikipedia guidelines, particularly WP:BIO, and it certainly does not make his wife Karina notable either. Nsk92 (talk) 18:59, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

But don't genealogy enthusisasts use Wikipedia Geneaology is a science like any other,it needs accuracy and reliable source of information.In this article? I found a lot of useful links for my personal research.I still find it opposes strongly to a huge number of impostors in Russia and Ukraine with their fake sites and investitures.True, Bagrations were once Kings of Georgia, so it is open to fruitless debate as to how "equal" or "unequal" they are to Romanovs.But that's not the point.What you should take to account is that" Bagration" name a long time ago grew a part of mass culture in Russia itself .Tobacconists "Bargration", restaurants,spirits, computer games, comics, business centers,-you name it.So everything which happens in real Bagration family is interesting and should correspond to WP:BIO(Within Wikipedia, notability is an inclusion criterion based on the encyclopedic suitability of an article topic. The topic of an article should be notable, or "worthy of notice"; that is, "significant, interesting, or unusual enough to deserve attention or to be recorded."[1] Notable in the sense of being "famous", or "popular" although not irrelevant is secondary). Sergeydancer (talk) 14:41, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

• Delete Without proper referencing, this is just so much rhubarb. Whether she is what is claimed or no, without evidence the article cannot stand on Wikipedia under WP:BLP. No matter how notable or otherwise, this referencing is essential. Peridon (talk) 15:55, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.