Login
Login

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Jews in sports (2nd nomination)

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. BJTalk 04:48, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

=[[List of Jews in sports]]=

AfDs for this article:
    {{Special:Prefixindex/Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Jews in sports}}

:{{la|List of Jews in sports}} ([{{fullurl:List of Jews in sports|wpReason={{urlencode: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Jews in sports (2nd nomination)}}&action=delete}} delete]) – (View AfD)(View log)

This is a case of overcategorisation in list form. Why is it relevant that these sportspeople are Jewish? We do't have lists of Christian or Muslim sportspeople, and nor should we. Cordless Larry (talk) 19:07, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Strong delete per nom.-Juvvaglott (talk) 19:55, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

:* Comment -- note that User:Juvvaglott's vote should not count since his/her account was just created a day ago, probably for the sole purpose of trying to delete this list. --Wassermann (talk) 05:14, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Delete changed to merge, but still per this: WP:NOTDIR, no. 5. "Non-encyclopedic cross-categorizations, such as 'People from ethnic/cultural/religious group X employed by organization Y' or 'Restaurants specializing in food type X in city Y.'" Graymornings(talk) 21:56, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete as overgategorization of the list variety. Besides, wasn't that just a leaflet that the one lady ordered from the stewardess offering something to read to the passengers in Airplane! ("Do you have anything light?")? MuZemike (talk) 23:38, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep. The role of the Jew in sports has been a subject of considerable scholarly and popular attention over the years. It is a significant topic within the discipline of Jewish studies. The Airplane! joke is a reference to an old stereotype, which Jewish studies scholars have taken pains to confront.[http://jbooks.com/secularculture/alpert.htm] There are numerous books on the subject. Just a few examples off a quick Google Books search (there are plenty more): Encyclopedia of Jews in Sports by Bernard Postal, Jesse Silver, Roy Silver (1965) (a book that I, and lots of other Jewish kids of my generation, had on the bookshelf); Great Jews in Sports by Robert Slater (2003), ISBN 0824604539 ; Emancipation Through Muscles: Jews and Sports in Europe by Michael Brenner, Gideon Reuveni, (2006) ISBN 0803213557 ; Jews, Sports, and the Rites of Citizenship ed. Jack Kugelmass (2007) ISBN 025207324X; Ellis Island to Ebbets Field: Sport and the American Jewish Experience by Peter Levine (1993) ISBN 0195085558 ; Judaism's Encounter with American Sports by Jeffrey S. Gurock (2005) ISBN 0253347009 .--Arxiloxos (talk) 00:20, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes, the relationship between Jews and sports is notable, but probably not in list form. Could we create an article about Jews in sports and merge this list (perhaps in abbreviated form) into that article? This seems to be over-listing rather than creating content. I'd be more than happy to work on such an article. Graymornings(talk) 22:13, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • That sounds like a sensible idea to me. Cordless Larry (talk) 23:05, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep Outside sources consider this a notable intersection, as Arxiloxos demonstrates. Jewish athletes do face unique dilemmas; consider the case of [http://espn.go.com/classic/s/merron_on_green.html Sandy Koufax and other baseball players], who refused to pitch on Yom Kippur. Zagalejo^^^ 04:06, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep in order to oppose the ongoing efforts to censor lists, categories, and articles dealing with Jews and Jewish issues here on Wikipedia. --Wassermann (talk) 05:11, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Please assume good faith with other editors. I doubt the people here siding for deletion have anything against Judaism or censorship henceforth. MuZemike (talk) 21:19, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Correct - my nomination has nothing to do with Judaism per se. I just don't see how the sportsperson-Jewish intersection is relevant. Cordless Larry (talk) 21:36, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • On the refusing to pitch on Yom Kippur point, I see that that would be worth mentioning on specific articles such as the one about Sandy Koufax, but I don't see how that justifies a list such as this. Cordless Larry (talk) 21:38, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep. I considered this a trivial intersection when I first looked at it. But Arxiloxos clearly demonstrated I was mistaken. - Mgm|(talk) 08:56, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. -- the wub "?!" 12:40, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. -- the wub "?!" 12:40, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep per Arxiloxos' research.  LinguistAtLarge  17:55, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep Sólyomszem (talk) 20:04, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

:*User has provided no reason behind rationale. MuZemike (talk) 21:17, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.