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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mic Wrath

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Please let me know, either on my talk page or via email if you wish to have a copy of the article to work on for future consideration. –MuZemike 06:48, 9 August 2011 (UTC)

=[[Mic Wrath]]=

:{{la|Mic Wrath}} – (View AfDView log)

:({{Find sources|Mic Wrath}})

Autobiographical article about a musician of questionable notability. Little significant coverage found outside primary sources/social media sites. Google search on "Mic Wrath" shows only about 135 unique results. Of the notability claims, I can't find reliable sources that back up the producer claim, acting roles appear to be minor/extra roles. MikeWazowski (talk) 22:51, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

:Note: This debate has been included in the list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions. — • Gene93k (talk) 00:54, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

:Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. — • Gene93k (talk) 00:54, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

(UTC)

:Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Courcelles 02:04, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

  • Delete per WP:BAND. [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Mic_Wrath&action=historysubmit&diff=442906951&oldid=442104110 Recent changes] by the primary author, Mic wrath, appear to be attempts to establish notability; if so they are unsuccessful. Mostly they are references to unreliable sources that do not mention the artist. Lagrange613 (talk) 21:12, 3 August 2011 (UTC)
  • Do NOT Delete per WP:BAND, All relevant references have now been added to this article and ARE reliable references. Most references state the artist using his previous name Rhyme'z which he is no longer known as, but is still active as a Artist. Mic wrath (talk) 22:11, 03 July August 2011 — Mic wrath (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

::Please read WP:RS. Blogs, other wikis, and YouTube are not considered reliable sources. Some of the new sources do indeed refer to a Rhymez, but again none of them establishes notability. Lagrange613 (talk) 21:44, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

  • Comment Regarding the recently added sources:
  1. L.D.B - Wordpress Blog. Blogs are not regarded as reliable sources; anyone can create them and say whatever they want.
  2. Kidz N The Hood - Grimepedia. This is a blank page.
  3. L.D.B - Yes Im That Guy Video - DJ SEMTEX. Again, it's a blog.
  4. BBC THREE - Singing With The Enemy. This is better - the BBC are an excellent source - but it makes no mention of Mic Wrath or Rhyme'z, and the video content has been withdrawn.
  5. Rago Magazine Intervie With Jay Full Stop. This gives me a 404 error, if anyone else can access this site they may be able to check it for notability. However, i did a search of Rago Magazine's archives - no hits for either Mic Wrath or Rhyme'z.
  6. Hood Tapes - Romance - Word Blossom. A mixtape site where anyone can upload their music. Again, not a reliable source.
  7. Mic Wrath - The Strong Move Silent Video. A YouTube video. Again, since anyone can upload whatever they want to YouTube, it is not a reliable source.
  8. Choice FM - Playlist. This does at least meet WP:RS, and verifies the statement in the text. However, it does nothing to demonstrate notability.
  9. StreetDance 3D Production Notes. Seems to be a dead link.
  10. DJ Semtex = StreetDance 3D Review. Yet another blog.
  11. Zion Website. Another dead link. Correcting the link indicates that a person who appears to be Mic Wrath (certainly looks like the chap in the YouTube video) has a role as a character in an as-yet-unreleased independent short film, which may or may not be notable in and of itself. Since the film has not yet been released, it is impossible to say whether or not this may confer notability. Given that independent shorts by unknown directors rarely set the world on fire, I think we can safely say that this too fails to make Mr Wrath noteworthy for inclusion.
  12. Zion - Character Profile Maxwell. Same website as above (another botched link).

See those links in the text above? If you want to keep this article, read 'em. Here they are again: Reliable Sources and Notability. Best of luck. Yunshui (talk) 23:45, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

:To read the deadlinky pages, delete the /s from the ends of the URLs. I did this myself within the article so we could continue the discussion. Lagrange613 (talk) 01:46, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

I Have read WP:RS Notability I understand. This individual is known by different names as I have highlighted before. You have M.D.R which stands for Mike Da Ripper/Murda Da Rhyme'z also short for Rhyme'z who was in a collective called Lyrically Scar'd. He is now known as Mic Wrath aka Romance, I dont know why he has different names but this is the same person. Below I have answered to your arguments about the links I put within the references. Mic wrath (talk) 09:29, 04 August 2011 — Mic wrath (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

  • Comment Regarding the recently added sources:
  1. L.D.B - Wordpress Blog. Blogs are not regarded as reliable sources; anyone can create them and say whatever they want

(yes very true, BUT looking along the page your see the names Rhyme'z & Romance which are stated in the Article I've also found this interview on You Tube which is of London Dream Boyz the group Rhyme'z/Romance has been affilated with. In this video you see Rhyme'z introuducing him self and the group >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOU5zDetdsQ) wacth from 6:00 and onwards.

  1. Kidz N The Hood - Grimepedia. This is a blank page (Removed, this as I understand this is not relevant)
  1. L.D.B - Yes Im That Guy Video - DJ SEMTEX. Again, it's a blog.

(yes it is a blog, but its a OFFICIAL blog written by the man himself giving visual evidence of Rhyme'z in the video, he even says his name before he raps his verse, you can also google this and it will say ft Rhyme'z)

  1. BBC THREE - Singing With The Enemy. This is better - the BBC are an excellent source - but it makes no mention of Mic Wrath or Rhyme'z, and the video content has been withdrawn.

(Lyrically Scar'd is the collective M.D.R, Mike Da Ripper/Murda Da Rhyme'z, Rhyme'z now known as Mic Wrath aka Romance used to be in. this is giving reference that the show existed. content has been removed but there is detailed writing there stating Lyrically Scar'd were a part of the show.)

  1. Rago Magazine Intervie With Jay Full Stop. This gives me a 404 error, if anyone else can access this site they may be able to check it for notability. However, i did a search of Rago Magazine's archives - no hits for either Mic Wrath or Rhyme'z.

(this is link works fine, It is a interview with Lyrically Scar'd member Jay Fullstop who states that Rhyme'z was in Lyrically Scar'd at that time and how he features on the track "Hotel Califiornia" which features on his debut Album City Meals, look under the section's Yeh lets talk about Lyrically Scar'd for a minute., When did that crew get together and who’s in it, what does each member bring to the table? and Do they feature on the mixtape or album? this clearly states the name Rhyme'z or Rhyme's >>> http://www.ragomagazine.com/interviews/jay-full-stop-v-from-south-london-uk.html)

  1. Hood Tapes - Romance - Word Blossom. A mixtape site where anyone can upload their music. Again, not a reliable source.

(But it does again state the Name "Romance" and if you go on You Tube & Type Mic Wrath it will come up with his YouTube Channel with Video's with the name Mic Wrath aka Romance and there are Video's on his channel using the same pictures from the the Website.)

  1. Mic Wrath - The Strong Move Silent Video. A YouTube video. Again, since anyone can upload whatever they want to YouTube, it is not a reliable source.

(How can this not be a reliable source? this is giving you VISUAL evidence of Mic Wrath, it is a video oploaded by the people who shot and edited the video? look at the person on the video *Tattoo on the neck* and this video is on various sites, Im sure if this was not Mic Wrath there would not be a demand for it to be put on sites?)

  1. Choice FM - Playlist. This does at least meet WP:RS, and verifies the statement in the text. However, it does nothing to demonstrate notability.

(Of course this demonstrates notability the same song in the Video is the same song played on Choice FM therefore the persons in the Video are the actual Artists that feature on the track. Mic Wrath clearly has a tatoo on his neck that reads "Respect Love & Loyalty" if you go to his you tube videos or even type his name in and follow his official Facebook fan profile you will clearly see pictures demonstrating this. Choice FM are one of the biggest radio staions in the UK im pretty sure they research the music before the play it on air that link shows you a playlist stating that Mic Wrath was played on Choice FM.

  1. StreetDance 3D Production Notes. Seems to be a dead link

( this is not a dead link, works fine, in the Production notes its states his name but they seem to have spelt it wrong spelling it as Rhime'z using the first Name Michael Idubor? which must be a previous surname he used to use but Visual evidence shows the person in this movie is Mic Wrath aka Romance, the scene that he is in shows a individual with the exact same tattoo on the neck he carrys "Respect Love & Loyalty" Im quite sure people dont get the same tatoo's across the neck these days? if you watch the linkbelow is shows Mic Wrath aka Romance along side DJ Semtex as is written in the article. >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJgo8Tt9beI&feature=related

  1. DJ Semtex = StreetDance 3D Review. Yet another blog.

(Again a OFFICIAL blog written by the man himself, stating his inclusion within the Movie why would he lie? theres visual evidence)

  1. Zion Website. Another dead link. Correcting the link indicates that a person who appears to be Mic Wrath (certainly looks like the chap in the YouTube video) has a role as a character in an as-yet-unreleased independent short film, which may or may not be notable in and of itself. Since the film has not yet been released, it is impossible to say whether or not this may confer notability. Given that independent shorts by unknown directors rarely set the world on fire, I think we can safely say that this too fails to make Mr Wrath noteworthy for inclusion.

( This is not a dead link, this is a official website stating Michael Raphael Davies who is Mic Wrath aka Romance is a lead character, look through the website and pictures, same guy with the Tattoo on his neck reading "Respect, love & Loyalty" is on there also there is a link to a facebook page showing a video on the page entitled ZION with below it 27 May 2011 if you watch that from 7:57 you will see a brief interview with Michael Raphael Davies again known as Mic Wrath aka Romance, also the guy has the same tattoo on his neck >>> https://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=10150255993030396&oid=220818981279833&comments. It is unfair to say "Unknown directors rarely set the world on fire" that is a opinion not a fact!, this short film features Aml Ameen who is a well established british Actor who's stardom came from the movies Kidulthood and Adulthood who won Noel Clarke a Bafta award. also it features another well known Actor, Ashley Walters who both of them you can google and loads of information would come up. So if its good enough for a Actor who was part of a Bafta winning Movie then it must be worth some acknowldegement.)

  1. Zion - Character Profile Maxwell. Same website as above (another botched link)

(No its not a botched link, as I have written above.)

Mic wrath (talk) 09:29, 04 August 2011 — Mic wrath (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

:Reply Hi Mic. If you'll forgive my saying so, although you may have read WP:RS it's pretty clear from your comments above that you haven't really understood it. I refer you specifically to the section on self-published sources, where it is clearly stated that "Anyone can create a website or pay to have a book published, then claim to be an expert in a certain field. For that reason self-published media—whether books, newsletters, personal websites, open wikis, blogs, personal pages on social networking sites, Internet forum postings, or tweets—are largely not acceptable." DJ Semtex' blog, YouTube, Hood Tapes and so on are therefore not considered, by Wikipedia standards, to be reliable sources of information. If I were to upload a video to YouTube in which I claimed Mic Wrath was the President of Greece, won the 1994 Mr Universe competition and eats a macrobiotic diet, would that information then be valid to quote in the article?

:Lagrange613 has helpfully fixed the article links, so I can see the Streetdance and Rago ones now. Neither convince me of Mr Wrath's notability. Please check the specific criteria for notability for musicians, and indicate which of the criteria there apply to Mic Wrath. I think we can write off number 1, but if he passes any of these (except, arguably, number 7), the article's a keeper. I have, believe me, tried to find one of these that could be applied, but so far I have failed; hence my !vote still remains unchanged. Yunshui (talk) 09:14, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

:Reply Yunshui I fully understand, apologies for before. The Article lacks the resources Wikipedia find acceptable to be kept! I do understand that! Im just trying to show resources that are common sense to see from a "Visual" point but quite difficult to put out as txt in the Article showing the WP:RS & notability of the resources. I suppose this article obviously needs more information from credible sources to be believed Perhaps if the Article was changed to Rhyme'z instead of Mic Wrath then we wouldnt be having this issue, its because this Artist is now named Mic Wrath its hard to find details that showcase his history under his new name. But its not rocket science, I've found lots of Articles on Wikipedia that have no WP:RS notability take a look for example at Mic Wrath ex collective member Jay Fullstop who's article is very similar and hardly has any sources as to what he's saying? so If he exists surely Mic Wrath does also take a look at the article Vex King, please take a look at these to understand the point Im making. Its just a Article giving the public information about a Artist? But if you must, Delete it!

Mic wrath (talk) 11:56, 04 August 2011 — Mic wrath (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

::Reply The issue is one of general notability, rather than name-changes - in looking for sources, I searched under Mic Wrath, Rhyme'z, Michael Raphael Davies and Romance (that last one was pretty hopeless!), but he isn't notable under any of these names: if he were, we could have an article on him. Noting that other articles are equally poorly sourced isn't much of an argument for retention, but you're right about the Jay Fullstop article being an issue; after another fruitless hunt for sources demonstrating his notability, I've reluctantly AfD'd that article too. Yunshui (talk) 12:23, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

::Reply Ok, on that Note I agree for this Article to be deleted. Thank you for making me understand the reasons why. I understand the article cannot be left blank so I've deleted most of the information that was on there before and have left minimum info so Wikipedia can delete it.

Thank you.

Mic wrath (talk) 13:48, 04 August 2011 — Mic wrath (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

:For anyone not following this closely, User:Mic wrath has [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Mic_Wrath&curid=32540739&diff=443006639&oldid=442995684 mostly blanked] the article. Are we done here? (I.e., can we agree to delete the article?) Lagrange613 (talk) 13:28, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.