Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pahari (Poonchi)

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:{{la|1=Pahari (Poonchi)}} – (View AfDView log | edits since nomination)

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Disputed drafification. WP:DRAFTOBJECT applies. Fails WP:GNG 🇵🇸‍🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦‍🇵🇸 12:05, 2 June 2025 (UTC)

• Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Language, Pakistan, and Jammu and Kashmir. 🇵🇸‍🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦‍🇵🇸 12:05, 2 June 2025 (UTC)
• Comment: I don't know if I'm seeing enough here for an article. The lone external link, presumably added to be a citation, does not contain the word "Pahari" at all after a {{keypress|Ctrl|F}}. Problems with my in-browser PDF reader, thanks to IP for making me re-check. Yes, there are two instances of the word in the document.{{cite journal |last1=Nazki |first1=Sameeul Haq |title=The Difficulties of English Language Acquisition in the State of Jammu and Kashmir: A Critical Survey |journal=Journal of Language and Linguistics in Society |date=17 September 2024 |issue=45 |pages=33–44 |doi=10.55529/jlls.45.33.44}} I also doubt the reliability of the publication Journal of Language and Linguistics in Society itself. If there is a citation that could back up something said in the article, it could be merged to Pahari language or Poonch District, India (depending on what can be said and sourced) but I'm not sure I'm seeing that right now. Bobby Cohn 🍁 (talk) 13:46, 2 June 2025 (UTC)
• :Stricken in part and updated. Yes, it looks like the best merge/redirect target would be Pahari-Pothwari#Kashmir, Murree and the Galyat where it is already bolded. I'm not seeing much to merge that isn't already covered by the article. Bobby Cohn 🍁 (talk) 15:38, 2 June 2025 (UTC)
• ::Poonchi Pahari is a dialect of Pahari, falling under the Western Pahari group. It is closely related to other dialects such as Chibhali Pahari, Mirpuri Pahari, and Kotli Pahari. It is only a dialect and does not require a separate article or classification as a distinct language. Only a few words are pronounced differently, but they are easily understood by speakers of Chibhali or Mirpuri Pahari or any Pahari. Mutual intelligibility is high across these dialects. HistoryofKashmir (talk) 15:11, 3 June 2025 (UTC)
• :::Hi HistoryofKashmir (talk), I am no expert in the History of Kashmir but did a bit of research and spoke to some scholars. Both Poonchi and Pothwari are closely related dialects, if not languages, but definitely are not identical or exactly the same. Pothwari is spoken in Rawalpindi, Jhelum, Mirpur, and surrounding areas in Pakistan, and by many in the UK, the Mirpuri immigrants.
• :::Poonchi is spoken mainly in Poonch, Rajouri districts of Jammu and Kashmir (India) and only in parts of Azad Kashmir (Pakistan), what we call PoK in India.
• :::Though similar linguistically, in a narrow sense there are vast variations in pronunciation, vocabulary and usage - basically influenced by the culture and histories on either side of the Line of Control and that makes it a major difference! My personal feeling... Davidindia (talk) 17:11, 11 June 2025 (UTC)
• Comment. The entirety of what the link says is: {{tq2|In the southern areas of Poonch and Rajouri, the primary language is Poonchi, also known as Pahari or Potohari. This language is part of the Lahnda/Punjabi family within the broader Indo-Aryan languages}} I'm no expert with this stuff (and can't judge the reliability of the source either), but is this just the same thing as Pahari-Pothwari? There's certainly nothing in the source to justify a separate article at the very least. 35.139.154.158 (talk) 15:28, 2 June 2025 (UTC)
• :Hi 35.139.154.158 (talk) I am also no expert, but I guess one is an Indo iranian language and the other, Indo Aryan. Related but not the same. Davidindia (talk) 16:59, 11 June 2025 (UTC)
• Keep. Have added info and refs. Please see if it helps -notability. I feel it is an imp. article that can be developed as sources exist. I found thru unreferenced drive. thanks and happy editing! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Davidindia (talk • contribs) 10:59, 4 June 2025

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• @Davidindia, If I'm reading correctly the "History" section you've added, would it be fair to say that the first paragraph with bullets points and the second paragraph (as of today) are general history not specific to "Pahari (Poonchi)" but rather the section on Pahari-Pothwari? If so, (but I'm happy to be corrected) I think merge would still be the best option. Bobby Cohn 🍁 (talk) 16:59, 11 June 2025 (UTC)
• :@Bobby Cohn Yes, I think three articles on the same dialects may not augur well. But i did not get any consensus among my scholar friends in a language school. Please see my reply above. Basically they are different dialects spoken on either side of the Line of Control. I came across in random search during unref drive: #June25 I guess we should merge. thanks! Davidindia (talk) 17:17, 11 June 2025 (UTC)

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:Keep. A complete overhaul of the page has been made alongside several sources that establish notability and verifiability and have an encyclopedic tone. Sazzrel (talk) 04:03, 20 June 2025 (UTC)

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:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.