Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Toni Ann Johnson

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:{{la|Toni Ann Johnson}} – (View AfDView log)

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Biography is has very little to no citations. Appears to be a vanity article. Appears to be fail GNG. If you look at the humanitas prize, she didn't win the award. The films won the award. BlackAmerican (talk) 06:02, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

Fails WP:AUTHOR, WP:FILMMAKER, WP:CREATIVE

Authors, editors, journalists, filmmakers, photographers, artists, architects, and other creative professionals:

The person is regarded as an important figure or is widely cited by peers or successors.

The person is known for originating a significant new concept, theory, or technique.

The person has created or played a major role in co-creating a significant or well-known work or collective body of work. In addition, such work must have been the primary subject of an independent and notable work (for example, a book, film, or television series, but usually not a single episode of a television series) or of multiple independent periodical articles or reviews.

The person's work (or works) has: (a) become a significant monument, (b) been a substantial part of a significant exhibition, (c) won significant critical attention, or (d) been represented within the permanent collections of several notable galleries or museums.
BlackAmerican (talk) 06:11, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

:Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Lightburst (talk) 14:12, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

:Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Theatre-related deletion discussions. Lightburst (talk) 14:12, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

:Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. Lightburst (talk) 14:13, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

:Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions. Lightburst (talk) 14:13, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

• Comment: Has won the Humanitas Prize twice, for Ruby Bridges (1998) and for Crown Heights (2004). Softlavender (talk) 06:49, 22 September 2020 (UTC)
• Speedy keep Easily passes WP:GNG. Theroadislong (talk) 07:20, 22 September 2020 (UTC)
• Keep She meets notability. JSFarman (talk) 14:18, 22 September 2020 (UTC)
• Keep. Award winning author and screenwriter. (Article creator may have had a COI four years ago, but that can or has been fixed through editing.) pburka (talk) 14:37, 22 September 2020 (UTC)
• Keep due to awards won, and other independant coverage. -Kj cheetham (talk) 15:52, 22 September 2020 (UTC)
• Keep: There were plenty of references before it was nominated; there are even more now. The nominator does not address why the 30+ citations currently in the article are insufficient. — Toughpigs (talk) 16:28, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

::comment My apologies. I saw a number of issues. For one, the Crown Heights reference was to a totally different movie with the same name Crown Heights (film) which shows it was written by Matt Ruskin. The movie The Courage to Love was a direct to cable tv. It seemed minor in my opinion. The Save the Last Dance was not for the film, but a TV pilot based on the film. Step Up 2: The Streets was not a major film. in my opinion. In terms of the Humanitas Prize. It is an award. I don't feel its a major award. [https://www.nytimes.com/1974/08/13/archives/humanitas-prize-is-added-to-awards-for-tv-writers-hoping-for-a.html] But even in Wikipedia, there is 61 film award groups just for America [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:American_film_awards] , there are also 29 categories for TV awards just for America [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:American_television_awards]. We aren't even considering that there are many subcatagories for the Humanitas Prize. If you look at the award on Wikipedia, she did not win the award. The film won the award. List of Humanitas Prize recipients . BlackAmerican (talk) 17:28, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

:::WP:NCREATIVE puts the threshold at "notable works". The Courage to Love and Step Up 2: The Streets both have Wikipedia articles, and therefore are presumed notable. Direct to cable TV can still be considered notable; these days, a large share of the notable TV work is either direct to cable (HBO, Showtime) or streaming (Netflix, Hulu, Amazon Prime). Saying that Step Up 2 is "not a major film" is your opinion, and doesn't have bearing on the notability of this article's subject. — Toughpigs (talk) 17:49, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

::::In the end, all I am giving is an opinion. Today direct to cable or streaming is a huge deal. During that era though it was a showing of a subpar film. The Step up 2 simply shows that she hasnt produced any major films or works BlackAmerican (talk) 18:34, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

::::: You quoted the guideline above. It does not say "major film". It says notable film. Both of those films are notable. Your opinion of whether it was "major" or "subpar" is not relevant. Bad films can be notable. — Toughpigs (talk) 18:57, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

::::Wikipedia is not a reliable source. She won the [https://variety.com/1998/film/news/damon-affleck-win-humanitas-pic-prize-1117478325/#! Humanitas] Award in 1998 and in [https://www.today.com/popculture/dirty-pretty-things-wins-humanitas-prize-wbna5397240 2004]. She did write Crown Heights. [https://www.worldcat.org/search?q=au:Johnson,+Toni+Ann,&qt=hot_author] JSFarman (talk) 18:01, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

:Very true, wikipedia is not a reliable source. The Crown Heights she wrote is a different film by the same name. The one that was linked earlier was from 2017. The one she wrote is from 2004. BlackAmerican (talk) 18:34, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

::I fixed the Crown Heights link in the article. -- Toughpigs (talk) 18:52, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

::: BlackAmerican, you stated that the film, not Toni Ann Johnson, won the Humanitas prize according to the Wikipedia article. She did win it, twice, based on the sources I referenced above. List of Humanitas Prize recipients is selective and doesn't cover all of the categories. (I noted this in the article, and if someone else doesn't edit it first, I'll add the additional categories when time permits.)

:::Also: everything that Toughpigs wrote. JSFarman (talk) 23:18, 24 September 2020 (UTC)

• Keeped - Meets notability requirements per the intent of the guideline/rule. Tsistunagiska (talk) 20:24, 24 September 2020 (UTC)
• Keep She meets the notability standard/requirements; she has plenty of valid citations. Veteranrecords (talk) 00:19, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

{{clear}}

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.