Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 November 17#Works set in outer space

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: delete. _signed, Rosguill ^talk 00:04, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Fictional sultans and sultanas to :Category:Fictional monarchs and :Category:Fictional Muslims

:Nominator's rationale: Contains only two characters from the same work. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 21:54, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Just delete, neither of the two targets are a defining characteristic and Jasmine is already in :Category:Disney Princess characters. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:14, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Delete per above --Lenticel ^(talk) 00:31, 20 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: dual merge to :Category:Fictional American Jews and :Category:Fictional American people in video games. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:43, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Fictional American Jews in video games to :Category:Fictional American Jews and :Category:Fictional American people in video games

:Nominator's rationale: WP:NARROWCAT with 3 articles. In the previous CfD in 2014, people mostly argued for bundling the nomination with other small categories, but disagreed how and for the most part did not comment on the specific proposal. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 21:52, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:16, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Merge per nom --Lenticel ^(talk) 13:14, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: triple merge to :Category:Murder–suicide in fiction, :Category:Fictional murderers, and :Category:Fictional suicides. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:44, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Fictional murder–suicides to :Category:Murder–suicide in fiction, :Category:Fictional murderers, and :Category:Fictional suicides

:Nominator's rationale: Contains only a single subcategory, :Category:Fictional suicide attacks. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 21:19, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

::Oppose AHI-3000 (talk) 21:20, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

:::Support per nom. @AHI-3000 what's the reasoning behind your opposition? Mason (talk) 21:50, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge, redundant category layer. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:19, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Merge per nom --Lenticel ^(talk) 13:14, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: delete. _signed, Rosguill ^talk 00:06, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Deaths in Raqqa to :Category:Deaths in Syria

:Nominator's rationale: Non-defining intersection for city of death. Mason (talk) 20:03, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

:*Delete WP:OCTRIVIA specifically forbids generic deaths-by-location categories like this one. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 20:08, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Delete, categories of death by location should be container categories by type of death. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:25, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Delete per nom --Lenticel ^(talk) 13:15, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge all as nominated. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:51, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Emigrants from the Weimar Republic to :Category:German emigrants

::* Propose merging :Category:Emigrants from the Weimar Republic to the United States to :Category:German emigrants to the United States

::* Propose merging :Category:Emigrants from the Weimar Republic to the United Kingdom to :Category:German emigrants to the United Kingdom

::* Propose merging :Category:Emigrants from the Weimar Republic to France to :Category:German emigrants to France

::* Propose merging :Category:Emigrants from the Weimar Republic to the Netherlands to :Category:German emigrants to the Netherlands

:* Propose merging :Category:Expatriates in the Weimar Republic to :Category:Expatriates in Germany

:* Propose merging :Category:Immigrants to the Weimar Republic to :Category:Immigrants to Germany

:Nominator's rationale: Regime is not defining for expatriates/emigrants/immigrants in this case. The Weimar Republic wasn't a separate country from Germany; it was merely a period within it. Mason (talk) 19:46, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:26, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Merge per nom. Good grief! -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:14, 21 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 16:17, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Deaths in the Weimar Republic to :Category:Deaths in Germany

:* Propose merging :Category:Road incident deaths in the Weimar Republic to :Category:Road incident deaths in Germany

:* Propose merging :Category:Suicides in the Weimar Republic to :Category:Suicides in Germany

:Nominator's rationale: non-defining intersection between political regime and death. Weimar Republic "was a historical period of Germany from 9 November 1918 to 23 March 1933, during which it was a constitutional federal republic" aka a different regime, but not a different country aka still germany. Mason (talk) 19:36, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge per nom after purging :Category:Deaths in the Weimar Republic (remove articles, which are not by type of death). Marcocapelle (talk) 20:28, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• :@Marcocapelle Should we start adding containerizing tags Deaths in FOO? I'd support doing that because I think that's how these categories have been intended to be used. Mason (talk) 01:45, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
• :* Yes, completely agree. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:28, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: dual merge to :Category:Hispanic and Latino American people in Indiana politics and :Category:Hispanic and Latino American mayors (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:52, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Hispanic and Latino American mayors in Indiana to :Category:Hispanic and Latino American people in Indiana politics and :Category:Hispanic and Latino American mayors

:Nominator's rationale: Per WP:SMALLCAT (1 article). No opposition to recreation if the number of articles grows. User:Namiba 16:09, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Support, also per WP:EGRS. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:49, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: Merge, omitting the articles held directly in the parent category, i.e. delete that one. Note: I moved several of those members down into the suicides category, and added others to :Category:Aviators killed in aviation accidents or incidents in Germany. – Fayenatic London 11:15, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Deaths in the German Empire to :Category:Deaths in Germany

:* Propose merging :Category:Tuberculosis deaths in the German Empire to :Category:Tuberculosis deaths in Germany

:* Propose merging :Category:Infectious disease deaths in the German Empire to :Category:Infectious disease deaths in Germany

:* Propose merging :Category:Suicides in the German Empire to :Category:Suicides in Germany

:Nominator's rationale: overlapping categories where political regime is not defining Mason (talk) 16:00, 5 November 2023 (UTC)

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{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 15:22, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Support per nom. --Asmodea Oaktree (talk) 18:01, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Containerize :Category:Deaths in the German Empire before merging. Deaths by location are meant to be container categories for subcats by type of death. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:00, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename all as nominated. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 01:14, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Computer criminals to :Category:Cybercriminals

:*Propose renaming :Category:Computer criminals by nationality to :Category:Cybercriminals by nationality

:*Propose renaming :Category:American computer criminals to :Category:American cybercriminals

:*Propose renaming :Category:British computer criminals to :Category:British cybercriminals

:*Propose renaming :Category:German computer criminals to :Category:German cybercriminals

:*Propose renaming :Category:Russian computer criminals to :Category:Russian cybercriminals

:Nominator's rationale: To match :Category:Cybercrime. Recommended in opposition to a CfDS for subcategory :Category:Fictional cybercriminals.

{{collapse top|Copy of WP:CFDS discussion ([Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Speedy&oldid=1185560314#Opposed_requests permalink])}}

• :Category:Fictional cybercriminals to :Category:Fictional computer criminals – C2C: Real-world counterpart is :Category:Computer criminals. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 17:09, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
• :Oppose this particular one due to the existence of :Category:Cybercrime. :Category:Computer criminals is the one that needs to be renamed to :Category:Cybercriminals. This one is fine and doesn't need to be renamed. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 09:20, 14 November 2023 (UTC)

{{collapse bottom}} –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 15:16, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Comment, this is an opposite rename direction in comparison with this discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:32, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

:Support renaming all aforementioned categories per nom. AHI-3000 (talk) 03:32, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

• Support Per nom. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 12:01, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:Paris 1 Panthéon-Sorbonne University alumni, with a redirect at the original nominated target name. – Fayenatic London 16:09, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Pantheon-Sorbonne University alumni to :Category:Panthéon-Sorbonne University alumni

:Nominator's rationale: It's the univeristy's official name. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:A452:7DDC:1:CDA6:47AC:F971:2358 (talk) 14:12, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

:Comment This nomination damaged the #NEW NOMINATIONS header to this page. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 14:41, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

::Rename to :Category:Paris 1 Panthéon-Sorbonne University alumni to match the main article exactly. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 14:43, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

::Rename to :Category:Paris 1 Panthéon-Sorbonne University alumni per WP:C2D. HouseBlaster^talk 01:16, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:Saigū. Saikū remains the place name per Talk:Saikū. :Category:Saiō is used to disambiguate :Category:Saiin and this category, no matter if Saiō has a primary topic. (non-admin closure) NmWTfs85lXusaybq (talk) 08:49, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Saikū to :Category:Saiō

:Nominator's rationale: There is an active discussion at Talk:Saiō#Requested_move_24_October_2023 and we might want to move this category back to its original name :Category:Saigū, but it was improperly speedy moved to a title representing something that it does not correspond to

One page was already moved to avoid this confusion Talk:Saikū_Palace#Requested_move_24_October_2023 and it is uncertain how things will go with the other move. Immanuelle ❤️💚💙 (talk to the cutest Wikipedian) 01:18, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

• Follow outcome of RM discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:21, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

:Oppose. Yeah, there's some confusion here about terminology. Basically, there are two kinds of Saiō/Itsuki no miko, the Ise Saiō (also called Saigū, or as Wikipedia seems to prefer Saikū) and Kamo Saiō (also called Sai'in). Because the Ise Saiō was more popular, the general term "Saiō" was often used to refer to her. Keep this category (or rename Saigū) and place it in parent category :Category:Saiō. -Invokingvajras (talk) 02:51, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

::Interesting! Do you think that adding some of this explanation to the category would help clear up the confusion? Mason (talk) 04:54, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

::* {{ping|Invokingvajras}} {{tq|as Wikipedia seems to prefer}} is an odd phrase, Wikipedia does not have any preferences by itself. What are they mostly called in reliable sources? Marcocapelle (talk) 09:09, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

::*:The most common rendering of the word is "Saikū". The majority of Japanese-language sources I've consulted pronounce it this way, as does the [https://www.bunka.pref.mie.lg.jp/saiku/| Saiku Historical Museum]. I think it would be ideal to move the current page to either "Saikū" or "Ise Saiō" and eventually create a page detailing the general concept of "Saiō" like the Japanese entry. -Invokingvajras (talk) 05:11, 11 November 2023 (UTC)

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{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Relisting comment: The RM at Talk:Saiō was closed as no consensus, but the one at Talk:Saikū is still open.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 13:56, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

::Comment There is a new RM at Talk:Saiō#Requested_move_13_November_2023. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 14:50, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: Merge * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 00:06, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Artists from the Colony of Victoria to :Category:19th-century Australian artists and :Category:Colony of Victoria people and :Category:Artists from Victoria (state)

:* Propose merging :Category:Businesspeople from the Colony of Victoria to :Category:Colony of Victoria people and :Category:19th-century Australian businesspeople

:* Propose merging :Category:Musicians from the Colony of Victoria to :Category:19th-century Australian musicians and :Category:Colony of Victoria people

:* Propose merging :Category:Engineers from the Colony of Victoria to :Category:19th-century Australian engineers and :Category:Colony of Victoria people

:* Propose merging :Category:Writers from the Colony of Victoria to :Category:19th-century Australian writers and :Category:Colony of Victoria people

:Nominator's rationale: We don't need to slice up 19th-century engineers/musicians/etc by which colony they were in. Regime is not defining. The colony only lasted from 1851-1901 Mason (talk) 01:03, 31 October 2023 (UTC)

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{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Edward-Woodrow (talk) 22:25, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

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{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 13:34, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Overkill. Place Clichy (talk) 23:56, 20 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: Merge * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 00:07, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Businesspeople from the Colony of Western Australia to :Category:19th-century Australian businesspeople and :Category:Colony of Western Australia people

:* Propose merging :Category:Writers from the Colony of Western Australia to :Category:19th-century Australian writers and :Category:Colony of Western Australia people

:* Propose merging :Category:Engineers from the Colony of Western Australia to :Category:19th-century Australian engineers and :Category:Colony of Western Australia people

:Nominator's rationale: ' We don't need to slice up 19th-century Writers by which colony they were in. Regime is not a defining intersection here. The colony only lasted from 1829-1901 Mason (talk) 01:05, 31 October 2023 (UTC)

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{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Edward-Woodrow (talk) 22:25, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

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{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 13:34, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge per nom. Overkill. Place Clichy (talk) 23:56, 20 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge all as nominated. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 19:57, 26 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose manually merging :Category:Cultural depictions of male criminals to :Category:Works about criminals

:* Propose manually merging :Category:Cultural depictions of female criminals to :Category:Works about criminals

:* Propose merging :Category:Cultural depictions of male serial killers to :Category:Cultural depictions of serial killers

:* Propose merging :Category:Cultural depictions of female serial killers to :Category:Cultural depictions of serial killers

:Nominator's rationale: merge per WP:OCEGRS and WP:NARROWCAT, while female criminals is a notable topic in its own right, cultural depictions of them is not. Manually merge the first two categories, because most of the content is already in a subcat by type of crime. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:45, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

::Support per nom. Mason (talk) 19:22, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:Cultural depictions of black people. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 20:10, 26 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Cultural depictions of Black people to :Category:Cultural depictions of black people

:Nominator's rationale: rename, "Black people" is not a proper name, align with :Category:Fictional black people. Marcocapelle (talk) 10:25, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

::Rename Some people have argued the Black people should be capitalized, but Wikipedia categories currently use the lowercase form. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 14:47, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

:::Support per laundrypizza03. I recall finding examples with each option, but in this case, happy to keep them consistent. Mason (talk) 19:04, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: rename. {{ping|Marcocapelle}}, you can start an additional nomination to discuss merging. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 16:31, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Kentucky women librarians to :Category:Librarians from Kentucky

:Nominator's rationale: I think that the intersection for gender and state isn't defining for librarians, but I think that we can shift the scope of the category. There isn't a :category:Librarians from Kentucky category (but there is one for :category:Librarians from West Virginia). (I've already added the two members to the American women librarians category) Mason (talk) 05:23, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Rename (per nom) or merge to :Category:American librarians by lack of other state categories (but West Virginia). Also add the articles to :Category:Women in Kentucky insofar they aren't already in that tree otherwise. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:52, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkltalk 16:32, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Kentucky women philanthropists to :Category:American women philanthropists and :Category:Philanthropists from Kentucky

:* Propose merging :Category:Kentucky women military personnel to :Category:American female military personnel and :Category:Military personnel from Kentucky

:* Propose merging :Category:Kentucky women historians to :Category:Historians from Kentucky and :Category:American women historians

:Nominator's rationale: Dual merge as this intersection is not defining. Followup to Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2023_November_4#Category:Kentucky_women_news_anchors Mason (talk) 05:16, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Support per nom, also add the articles to :Category:Women in Kentucky insofar they aren't already in that tree otherwise. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:00, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge to :Category:Omani politicians. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:54, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Omani politicians by century to :Category:Omani politicians

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge for now. There's only one category in here, and it's not helpful for navigation. Mason (talk) 01:37, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Support, redundant category layer. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:05, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The result of the discussion was: merge all as nominated. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:53, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Nauruan people by occupation and century to :Category:Nauruan people by century

:* Propose merging :Category:Bahamian people by occupation and century to :Category:Bahamian people by century

:* Propose merging :Category:Cameroonian people by occupation and century to :Category:Cameroonian people by century

:* Propose merging :Category:Gibraltarian people by occupation and century to :Category:Gibraltarian people by century

:* Propose merging :Category:Dominica people by occupation and century to :Category:Dominica people by century

:Nominator's rationale: Upmerge for now. There's only one category in here, and it's not helpful for navigation. Mason (talk) 01:32, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge, redundant category layer. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:07, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Support per nom --Lenticel ^(talk) 12:34, 19 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: merge to :Category:Burkinabé actors. Merging has the numbers, and LaundryPizza's argument is strong. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:56, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Burkinabé actors by century to :Category:Burkinabé actors

:Nominator's rationale: upmerge for now. it isn't helpful for navigation with only one category Mason (talk) 01:31, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge, redundant category layer. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:07, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Keep, the C21 subcat was easily created and populated. – Fayenatic London 12:09, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Even so, it is very unlikely we will be able to populate 19th-century categories and older. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:43, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Merge The modern country of Burkina Faso was established in 1960, so it cannot be any older. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 15:46, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Merge per nom. Place Clichy (talk) 00:09, 21 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) HouseBlaster^talk 22:54, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{lc|Privately educated musicians}}

:Nominator's rationale: not defining Mason (talk) 01:29, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

• Delete per WP:TRIVIALCAT. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:08, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
• Delete per above --Lenticel ^(talk) 12:35, 19 November 2023 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.