Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2023 August 9

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template(s) or module(s) below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was relisted on 2023 August 18. (non-admin closure) Edward-Woodrow :) _[talk] 12:35, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

• {{tfd links|Witchcraft_sidebar}}

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template(s) or module(s) below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. Izno (talk) 20:36, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

• {{Tfd links|Chembox/doc/table of identifiers}}

No transclusions or documentation. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:13, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

• Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 00:53, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template(s) or module(s) below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. Izno (talk) 20:35, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

• {{Tfd links|Chembox/doc/image-ordering}}

No transclusions or documentation. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:13, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

• Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 00:53, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template(s) or module(s) below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. Izno (talk) 20:35, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

• {{Tfd links|Drug links/doc/table}}

No transclusions or incoming links. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:09, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

• Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 00:53, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template(s) or module(s) below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete , but only the page names listed. Izno (talk) 20:41, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

• {{Tfd links|Danish Social Liberal Party-light-color}}
• {{Tfd links|Danish People's Party-light-color}}
• {{Tfd links|Christian Democrats (Denmark)-light-color}}
• {{Tfd links|Schleswig Party-light-color}}
• {{Tfd links|Liberal Alliance (Denmark)-light-color}}
• {{Tfd links|Green Left (Denmark)-light-color}}

No transclusions or documentation. Likely redundant to {{tl|Political party}}, which resulted from a merge of hundreds of templates like this one. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:07, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

:Delete. Any new party color should be added to Module:Political party and not created by new templates. Gonnym (talk) 08:26, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::Unless these are meant to be used as shading colors, then these should be renamed to follow the convention of party name}} (such as Template:Party shading/Danish People's Party; see also :Category:Denmark political party shading templates) and placed inside the correct category. Gonnym (talk) 08:32, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

:::I was unaware that there were rules that these should be called something specific. As long as I can simplify my tables by being allowed to use templates, I will rename the templates as Party shading instead. Thomediter (talk) 10:02, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::::The nominated templates are now unused redirects and since they are already nominated, then I support their deletion. The new names which are used are much more clearer and follow the more established naming convention. Gonnym (talk) 14:02, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

:@Jonesey95 @Gonnym

:I've now moved all the templates, so that they are called party shading, and put them in a category here, along with creating documentation pages for them.

:I think and hope this can just be closed as a case of misunderstanding. So I really hope these templates won't be deleted, but if you really insists so, please explain to me why this is.

:For the pages of - Template:Social Democrats (Denmark)-light-color : Template:Danish People's Party-light-color : Template:Venstre (Denmark)-light-color, I wasn't able to move to these into party shading templates, so these should at best just be deleted.

:Have a nice day to you, and thanks for your help and understanding of my intention with these pages - Gonnym. Thomediter (talk) 10:43, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::So @Jonesey95 - is it ok if I delete the nominations you put on my talk page, or do you still nominate the shading templates for deletions? Thomediter (talk) 15:52, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

:::You may absolutely delete the notices from your talk page, per WP:REMOVED. I see that {{tl|Danish People's Party-light-color}} has not been moved yet. If it is moved to a more standard location, I will happily withdraw this nomination. – Jonesey95 (talk) 17:39, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::::Alright thanks :)

::::About {{tl|Danish People's Party-light-color}}, I'm not able to move the page because a page called "Template:Party shading/Danish People's Party" already exists, and I am able to use that template for my purposes.

::::So Danish People's Party-light-color should just be deleted, as it has no purpose since the page Template:Party shading/Danish People's Party exists.

::::Have a nice evening, :) Thomediter (talk) 19:46, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

:The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template(s) or module(s) below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. Plastikspork _―Œ^(talk) 13:27, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

• {{Tfd links|Template link with numbered parameters}}

This is another template link style template by Grufo with additional functionality that does not appear to actually have a use case. This is completely unused outside of documenting it's own existence, and appears to exist more to find a use for a parameter processing module than serving an actual need.

This template is essentially identical in functionality to {{tl|tlp}}, but it automatically numbers any unnamed parameters and sorts any named parameters alphabetically. The template link style templates are mainly used in internal discussions and documentation, it therefore makes very little sense to be using lua modules to change the ordering or formatting of the parameters - as doccumentation/explanation they should appear as written in the author. The whole point of unnamed parameters is that you can omit the "1=" part of the template argument, so it makes no sense to indiscriminately add the parameter names in documentation. The sorting of named parameters alphabetically is highly unlikely to result in a useful/sensible parameter ordering, e.g. would you demonstrate a time/date processing template with the parameters ordered "Day, Hour, Minute, Month, Second, Year"? This is unused, has features that are not useful and is redundant to other templates - as such it should be deleted. 192.76.8.66 (talk) 02:10, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

• Keep:
• “{{tq|This is completely unused outside of documenting it's own existence}}”:
• : It could hardly be otherwise, as the template was created less than twenty days ago.
• “{{tq|It therefore makes very little sense to be using lua modules to change the ordering or formatting of the parameters}}”:
• : The template's goal is not that of changing the parameter order, but that accompanying unnamed parameters with their positional number in those cases in which that is the wanted result. For proposals concerning minor details such as the order of parameters, the template's talk page might be what you are looking for.
• “{{tq|The whole point of unnamed parameters is that you can omit the "1{{=}}" part of the template argument}}”:
• : Documentation pages that show the parameter number explicitly in order to avoid confusion have always existed, and especially when the number of unnamed parameters is not small it is a very good thing that they do so. Moreover, writing or not writing a parameter number explicitly carries a series of consequences (such as the way leading and trailing spaces are treated, the way the equals sign is treated, the way other parameters are treated, and so on), and there are cases in which using a number explicitly might not just be an aesthetic choice as you seem to believe.

: --Grufo (talk) 02:42, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::Once again, I am asking you to stop with the insults an implications that I don't know what I am talking about. I am well aware that there are cases where the addition of a name changes the behaviour of the parameter - that being the case is only a stronger argument that parameter numbers should be added manually, by the author of the documentation, where they are either actually required or where they demonstrate something useful.

::All of the potential use cases you give can be covered by adding the parameter numbers to the input of {{tl|tlp}} or similar, there is no reason to be adding parameter numbers with LUA. 192.76.8.66 (talk) 03:01, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::: “{{tq|[...] by adding the parameter numbers to the input of {{tl|tlp}} or similar, there is no reason to be adding parameter numbers with LUA}}”: The {{tl|tlp}} template uses Lua as much as {{tl|tlnp}} does. Writing numbers automatically is precisely the ultimate purpose of {{tl|tlnp}} and has few to do with Lua – if you tolerated (strong) limitations this template could be rewritten in pure wikitext as well. Its motivation comes from the fact that writing numbers manually is infamously error-prone. For instance, look at the documentation of {{tl|Module link}}; it contains the following example: {{tji|ml|Example|count_fruit|4: bananas{{=}}10|5: kiwis{{=}}5}}, and this clearly contains an error, because the last two parameters should have been {{tjp|3: bananas{{=}}10}} and {{tjp|4: kiwis{{=}}5}} (I suspect that someone removed a former third parameter containing the word {{tjp|Fred}}, as the next example seems to suggest, but I will leave this investigation to you). If not all the cases, at least some cases will become safe from human errors by adopting this template. --Grufo (talk) 03:51, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::::You couldn't use this template on that documentation page because the whole point of that line is showing usage of parameter names for parameters that have = signs, the first two parameters should not be numbered. The source code for the documentation should be fixed, rather than trying to retroactively "fix" this in lua. 192.76.8.66 (talk) 09:36, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

::::: “{{tq|Rather than trying to retroactively "fix" this in lua}}”: Once again, the {{tl|tlp}} template uses Lua as much as {{tl|tlnp}} does. Nobody will force you to rely on machines to do the counting for you, but I would advise you to do so when you edit a public resource like Wikipedia. --Grufo (talk) 12:22, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

• Delete as with Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2023 August 8#Template:Template link with sorted parameters - yet another redundantly complicated way of doing the same thing. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 23:59, 14 August 2023 (UTC)
• : “{{Tq|Doing the same thing}}”? Could you elaborate in which way this template would be similar to {{tl|tlap}} (in its purpose, aim, use case, utility, and so on)? How can a template whose primary purpose is that of displaying parameter numbers be “doing the same thing” as a template that does not display parameter numbers? --Grufo (talk) 19:11, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
• :: I was using {{tq|thing}} more generically as "format template links". The uselessness of the auto-number functionality has been explained by the IP above. Your replying to nearly every comment in this discussion is inappropriate and not going to convince any of us. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 21:55, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
• Delete for similar reasons to the other template nominated; this is a solution looking for a problem. Primefac (talk) 13:21, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
• Delete per other discussion. Izno (talk) 19:46, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
• : “{{tq|per other discussion}}”: Which other discussion and how is it related? Why exactly would you want to delete a template that automatically adds numbers to the displayed parameters? --Grufo (talk) 20:57, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
• ::This one. Izno (talk) 01:53, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

:The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).