Wikipedia talk:Teahouse#Making the Teahouse Q.26A archive easily browsable and searchable

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== Assistance for new editors==

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NOTICE: AN APOLOGY TO VERY NEW EDITORS

Just a quick observation to those editing the introductory template: Might it not be worth mentioning the ability to directly contact a Mentor with their question? Nick Moyes (talk) 23:14, 18 February 2025 (UTC)

:{{ping|Nick Moyes}} I [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=1287503716 added] a bit to that template about the Mentors. Thoughts? ‍Relativity ⚡️ 17:54, 26 April 2025 (UTC)

::Update: I [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=1287504879 reworded] my original edit slightly, because I thought new editors might not know what a "mentor" is on Wikipedia. ‍Relativity ⚡️ 18:03, 26 April 2025 (UTC)

Terms of art

I've written a new essay, WP:Terms of art on Wikipedia, which may be helpful when new editors are confused by words like "notable" which have specific meanings on WP that differ from the general meaning. Improvements are welcome. Sunrise (talk) 07:42, 9 April 2025 (UTC)

Two ideas: DiscussionTools link for helpme and using Pending changes

I have two ideas for the Teahouse:

For the "Use this link to ask for help" link, mw:Help:DiscussionTools#Preloading message content says you can use dtpreload=1. If that can be used signatures will be applied automatically so the preload text could be simplified, plus users get the live preview. The link uses {{tl|edit}} which doesn't seem to accept dtpreload, but is it technically possible and desirable?
Would Wikipedia:Pending changes be suitable for times when the Teahouse is semi-protected?

Commander Keane (talk) 06:44, 13 April 2025 (UTC)

:Unfamiliar with the preloading message content solution, but pending changes was discussed at AN in November{{snd}}there seem to have been mixed feelings about it at the time. Perfect4th (talk) 16:50, 18 April 2025 (UTC)

"This section is pinned" appearing in the wrong place

Probably a screen width / float clearing issue of some sort. For me (using Vector 2010), the "this section is pinned" box whose code is in the intro message is actually appearing below the ToC on the right, currently inside the "How to seek Visual and Source editor experts" section -- which is misleading.

I tried adding the {{tlg|clear}} template to the bottom of the "Assistance for new editors unable to post here" section, but due to the length of the ToC that created other display issues, so I didn't save it. Maybe someone with more experience with wiki layout issues could fix it? -- Avocado (talk) 16:37, 18 April 2025 (UTC)

Manually archived

Why is this page in :Category:Pages that should not be manually archived? Neither WP:Help desk and WP:COIN, for example, are.

Unless there is a good reason, I propose to remove the category. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:12, 28 April 2025 (UTC)

:The Teahouse is already periodically archived by Lowercase sigmabotIII, so it sounds like it's in an appropriate category. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 14:51, 28 April 2025 (UTC)

::As are the examples I gave, and many others that are not in the category. Indeed, the category only has 28 members (21 of which are Teahouse and its sub-pages); bot archiving is used on tens or hundreds of thousands of pages. The two methods are not mutually exclusive. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 15:03, 28 April 2025 (UTC)

Removed from the Wikipedia:Teahouse/Header pseudo-template. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:42, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

:@Pigsonthewing, my guess is that it may have something to do with the talk page messages that are (or at one point were?) sent to editors when their thread gets archived. I'd double check that manual archiving doesn't interfere with that or some other process. It'd also be good to find the edit that added to see if there's a summary/ping the editor. There are potential WP:FENCE concerns. Sdkb ^talk 15:03, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

::Added by User:Ammarpad in 2019 with the edit summary "replace with the newer header to migrate the code here", in {{diff|Wikipedia:Teahouse/Header|prev|892554462|this diff}}. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 18:59, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

:::Sounds like it was probably originally added somewhere else? Sdkb ^talk 21:44, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

::::Yes the page was in the category already. That edit just moved the header code {{diff|Wikipedia:Teahouse/Header|prev|892554741|from the page source text}} to /Header subpage template to reduce the bloat.

::::As far as I can see, the category was originally added to the page (via template) in 2014 {{diff|Template:TH question page|prev|636538199|in this edit}}, before the code later ended up in the page directly and then re-templated again in 2019. – Ammarpad (talk) 17:10, 1 May 2025 (UTC)

:::::OK, so there's no explanation there and the editor is now blocked, so I think we've done our due diligence to the extent possible. If removing it causes any explosions, I guess we'll find out. Sdkb ^talk 19:08, 1 May 2025 (UTC)

::Just as an FYI on {{tq|talk page messages that are (or at one point were?) sent to editors when their thread gets archived}}—I did check one of the messages {{u|Pigsonthewing}} manually archived and didn't see {{botlinks|KiranBOT}} (actual BRFA) leave a message for that thread on OP's user talk, so not conclusive, just a casual comment. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 17:18, 11 May 2025 (UTC)

:{{re|Pigsonthewing}} Hello. Yes, {{u|Sdkb}} is correct. Similar to {{u|Rotideypoc41352}}'s doubt, KiranBOT doesnt fully depend on archival by Lowercase sigmabot III, but KiranBOT does rely on the edit summary, especially the number of discussions mentioned in edit summary by sigmabot III. —usernamekiran (talk) 04:06, 12 May 2025 (UTC)

::Thanks for the clarification. In the unlikely event anyone's wondering, I didn't say anything when I noticed [that manually archived posts do not result in user talk posts] because the original bot's doc at User:Muninnbot/doc#General principles of bot design says, {{tq|it was decided very early on that when it comes to determining notifications, a false positive is much more problematic than a false negative...it is acceptable to miss some notifications}} (wikilink original). While the two bots use different logic (per KiranBOT's BRFA), Munninbot also relied on lowercase sigmabot III: {{tq|Then, it pulls the latest archival edit by lowercase sigmabot III and looks at which sections were removed from the page by this edit}} (wikilink original). Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 20:04, 12 May 2025 (UTC)

Semi-Protection

What's up with the semi-protection on Wikipedia Teahouse?

Is this going to be unprotected soon? How would this affect newcomers who joined Wikipedia to contribute? 205.155.225.249 (talk) 20:20, 28 April 2025 (UTC)

:The Teahouse is semi-protected because of persistent vandalism from an LTA user. If the main page is semi-protected, newcomers can come here to ask questions; in the event that this page is protected, they are encouraged to the {{tl|help me}} template or the link in the large message box at the top here. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 20:28, 28 April 2025 (UTC)

:Please see the notice posted to the top of this page. Due to ongoing, persistent disruption by a VPN-using IP hopper engaging in personalized, virulent harassment of another editor, we’ve had to protect a range of pages. IP and other non-autoconfirmed editors can still edit most of the encyclopedia and seek guidance via the method described in the notice. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 20:29, 28 April 2025 (UTC)

::You can get a sense of how pervasive and disruptive this has all been by taking a look at this page’s editing history. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 20:42, 28 April 2025 (UTC)