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Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2018 November 5#Swaziland

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= November 5 =

== Eswatini templates ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Rename. Timrollpickering 22:16, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:Propose renaming:

:* :Category:Swaziland football navigational boxes to :Category:Eswatini football navigational boxes

:* :Category:Swaziland football templates to :Category:Eswatini football templates

:* :Category:Swaziland navigational boxes to :Category:Eswatini navigational boxes

:* :Category:Swaziland politics and government templates to :Category:Eswatini politics and government templates

:* :Category:Swaziland sports navigational boxes to :Category:Eswatini sports navigational boxes

:* :Category:Swaziland sports templates to :Category:Eswatini sports templates

:Nominator's rationale: the head article for this small African country has been moved from {{noredirect|Swaziland}} to Eswatini, per two RM discusisons (RM 12 October 2018 to "eSwatini", then RM 24 October 2018 to the conventionally-categorised form "Eswatini").

:Category names should follow the article name, and the parent category for all templates from this country has already been WP:BOLDly moved by {{ping|Wiz9999|p=}} to :Category:Eswatini templates. All these category titles are descriptive title per WP:NDESC, i.e. a phrase such as Swaziland football templates has been invented by en.wp editors to describe a set of articles, and is not a proper name. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:01, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • See also the discussion below on 435 non-template categories at #Swaziland. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:02, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support Per nom, they should match the article, unless they refer to times before the name change (and not currently). Crouch, Swale (talk) 22:04, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support per nom. --Gonnym (talk) 10:03, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support per nom. Agathoclea (talk) 22:04, 10 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:S.S. Cavese 1919 players ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:34, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:S.S. Cavese 1919 players and :Category:U.S.D. Cavese 1919 players to :Category:Cavese 1919 players

:Nominator's rationale: The two "clubs" were under the same article title Cavese 1919, thus the two cat should merged as {{c|Cavese 1919 players}} Matthew hk (talk) 16:13, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

:Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related page discussions. Matthew hk (talk) 06:29, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Merge and rename per C2D, match parent article name. GiantSnowman 09:25, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:People convicted of rape by nationality ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: do not merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:36, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:People convicted of rape by nationality to :Category:Rapists by nationality

:Nominator's rationale: This seems like a duplicated category. Either have :Category:People convicted of rape by nationality or have :Category:Rapists by nationality but why both? I don't see the distinction between being convicted of rape and being a rapist. If the issue is one of labeling, then merge to the less stigmatized convicted of rape category rather than the rapist category. Liz Read! Talk! 15:51, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Oppose, both procedurally and substantively.
  • #Procedurally, this nomination is pointless. All it does is remove a {{tl|container category}}. The only effect of that is to ensure that {{cl|American people convicted of rape}}, {{cl|Australian people convicted of rape}} etc are no longer grouped in a common parent category. To achieve the stated goal, each subcat would need to be listed individually for merger or renaming.
  • # Substantively
  • #*The categorisation of people convicted for a crime as a subcat of those who committed the crime is widespread. See the many subcats of :Category:People by criminal conviction, most or all of which are subcats of a category not based on conviction: e.g. :Category:People convicted of forgery is a subcat of :Category:Forgers. No reason is given for singling out rapists, while leaving the split in place for murderers, arsonists, fraudsters, thieves etc.
  • #*the suggestion to {{tq|merge to the less stigmatized convicted of rape category rather than the rapist category}} is daft. It will categorise as "convicted" people who have not been convicted. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 21:40, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

::I proposed this merger alone because I came across these 2 categories and other sex offender categories while doing some editing. I didn't look at all "Convicted of" categories. It looks like a duplication to me as I stated above so I made the proposal. But it looks like my argument will not prevail. Liz Read! Talk! 01:52, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Oppose Per the arguments of BrownHairedGirl. Note, however, that the accounts of rape should have reliable sources. We don't want to reproduce rumors and urban legends in the category tree. Dimadick (talk) 22:39, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • If anything REverse merge. We cannot generally have categories on unconvicted criminals, due to the risk of libel claims. The only exception is where the criminal is dead, but his guilt was clear: this is more likely to apply to dead murderers than rapists: rape is difficult to get convictions, because often only two people were present and it is the word of one against the other. Peterkingiron (talk) 19:09, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment "because often only two people were present" This is not the case in gang rape cases, and often not the case in wartime sexual violence. Dimadick (talk) 07:38, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Keep to maintain an objective inclusion criterion for what otherwise could be a slanderous category. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 18:04, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Sex offenders in Florida ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: {{relisted}} at 2018 NOV 13 CFD. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:39, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{Lc|Sex offenders in Florida}}

:Nominator's rationale: There is no basis to have state designated categories for sex offenders and no others exist. Each article listed in this category already has a sex-offense related category assigned, this one, focused on a state, is redundant and gives the impression that Florida has a unique problem with sex offenses. Liz Read! Talk! 15:35, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Delete - Wikipedia is not a sex offender registry. Also, WP:UNDUE concerns per nom. cymru.lass (talk • contribs) 16:11, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Keep. I’m the one who created the category, here’s my rationale. Florida does have “a unique problem with sex offenders”. It’s not “just another state” with sex offenders.
  • [http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/america-tonight/articles/2014/4/5/florida-becomes-theharsheststateforsexoffenders.html Florida has the harshest controls on sex offenders of any state.]
  • [https://www.cheatsheet.com/culture/sex-crimes-states-with-most-registered-sex-offenders.html/ Florida has the second highest number of sex offenders of any state.]
  • Florida has 5% of the nation’s population, but 8% of the nation’s sex offenders.
  • Florida has the largest number of sex offenders civilly committed. (References for both of these at Florida Civil Commitment Center.)
  • Florida has the largest community of sex offenders in the United States: Miracle Village.
  • Movies (documentaries) have been made (outside the U.S.) specifically about sex offenders in Florida. I am unaware of movies made about sex offenders of any other state.
  • Pervert Park
  • Miracle Village#movies
  • Florida Civil Commitment Center#Media attention
  • An off-Broadway play was produced in 2018 about the Miracle Village community: America Is Hard to See (play).
  • Florida has in Miami the largest community of homeless sex offenders in the U.S.: Julia Tuttle Causeway sex offender colony.

:So that’s my case why Florida uniquely deserves this category. deisenbe (talk) 14:19, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

:::While I see your point, I think if we are going to categorize sex offenders/sex crimes based in Florida to a category like this, then we should create similar categories for every state when it is appropriate. That's my point of view on this. Liz Read! Talk! 01:56, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

::::I quite agree. deisenbe (talk) 20:26, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

::The problem with renaming it sex crimes is that the items in the category are not sex crimes, they are sex criminals. I don’t see where “topic articles” are in it. deisenbe (talk) 01:03, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

::* Only 2 out of 10 articles in this category are about a criminal. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:28, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Films divided in chapters ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Delete. Timrollpickering 18:33, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{Lc|Films divided in chapters}}

:Nominator's rationale: I'm not convinced that this is a defining characteristic of films. I think any film could be arbitrarily divided into chapters...or conversely, that the "chapter breaks" could be removed without significantly impacting the final product. DonIago (talk) 14:41, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Delete per nom, as being non-defining. Lugnuts Fire Walk with Me 16:03, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Delete per nom. It may define some films (e.g., Dunkirk), but it does not define all films. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 16:12, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:BL Lac objects ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Rename. Timrollpickering 18:34, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:BL Lac objects to :Category:BL Lacertae objects

:Nominator's rationale: Avoid abbreviations in titles, and match the corresponding article BL Lacertae object. Lithopsian (talk) 14:16, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Support: not every reader is going to be familiar with standard IAU constellation abbreviations, so it makes sense to use the full name for a category. This is consistent with the :Category:Variable stars tree sub-category names. Praemonitus (talk) 21:34, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support: should be more consistent this way. Psyluke (talk) 13:36, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Organization to organisation (Commonwealth) ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Rename. The discussion here & precedent favour national consistency over subject consistency. Timrollpickering 18:51, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Cancer organizations based in Australia to :Category:Cancer organisations based in Australia per :Category:Organisations based in Australia etc.

:Nominator's rationale: This nomination seeks to apply the long-term stable WP:ENGVAR-derived convention to defer to the usage of the top-level country category's creator, which is 'organisations' in all listed below. The countries in this particular nom have strong UK links. Oculi (talk) 13:42, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

{{cot| India per :Category:Organisations based in India (9 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Ireland per :Category:Organisations based in Ireland (5 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Kenya per :Category:Organisations based in Kenya (6 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Malaysia per :Category:Organisations based in Malaysia (4 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Pakistan per :Category:Organisations based in Pakistan (5 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Sri Lanka]] per :Category:Organisations based in Sri Lanka (7 cases)}}

{{cob}}

::* [All but 6 of these anomalies courtesy of Rathfelder]

::*There is a companion discussion 'ise' to 'ize' intended merely to root out a few stray 'ess's from 'zed' trees at cfd on 3 Nov. Editors might note WP:ISE and MOS:IZE. Oculi (talk) 12:14, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

::::{{yo|Oculi}} did you actually read WP:ISE and the next para MOS:IZE? It doesn't support your case.

::::The MOS is very clear that:

::::# WP:ISE is one variant of British English. It uses organisation

::::# MOS:IZE is both American, and another variant of British English use organization

::::So organization is acceptable use everywhere, and British English does not require organisation.

::::The result is that this nomination is just shuffling between two acceptable forms. Inconsistencies in the country tree are being replaced with inconsistencies in the subject tree. This benefits neither readers nor editors. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 23:23, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

::::: My case would be that both are indeed acceptable (except in NZ and the US), but mixing them is not (in country trees; it is inevitable in subject trees, roughly 50/50). This has been tested at cfd many times: France, Brazil, Bolivia, Iran, Angola, Greece, Poland, Israel, Puerto Rico, Turkey, not to mention a slew in 2013 most of which contain "UK English predominates in Europe, so we should use the UKanian spelling. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:36, 21 June 2013 (UTC)". None of them call for RFCs or support a mixture, or are contentious. Oculi (talk) 10:23, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Oppose. For goodness sake, centralise the discussion at RFC. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:34, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support per WP:ENGVAR. Not everyone uses American spellings, and all of these countries use organisation, as highlighted by their main category being spelt organisation not organization. Joseph2302 (talk) 22:20, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose Nothing is gained by giving up the use of z which is perfectly acceptable in British English.Rathfelder (talk) 07:49, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support per WP:ENGVAR and in the spirit of WP:C2C, shouldn't these be wholly uncontroversial moves? Marcocapelle (talk) 21:48, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

:* One would have thought so. Oculi (talk) 01:48, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

::* {{yo|Marcocapelle}} The point which Oculi seems to want to overlook is that it is controversial because it is not a straightforward ENGVAR issue like petrol/gasoline.

:::The Z form is not just acceptable in British English. It is actually the recommended form of Oxford spelling, and also recommended by other major dictionaries: Cassell, Collins and Longman. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 05:30, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

  • "there are always some people around who like to tell other people what to do, especially where language is concerned" http://random-idea-english.blogspot.com/2013/01/some-random-thoughts-about-ise-and-ize.htmlRathfelder (talk) 08:09, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Reluctant support: these are right in principle, as odd-ones-out within the national hierarchies, but let's have an RFC on the whole hierarchy. – Fayenatic London 12:48, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Rename all. The Z form is American English, not British English. It is acknowledged in British dictionaries, because the American form exists. For example, where British academic journals have style instructions that detailed, they always ask for the S spelling. Peterkingiron (talk) 19:15, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Peterkingiron is wrong to think that the Z form is American English. Rathfelder (talk) 16:50, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Organization to organisation (Europe) ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:40, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Paramilitary organizations of the Weimar Republic to :Category:Paramilitary organisations of the Weimar Republic per :Category:Organisations based in Germany etc.

:Nominators rationale: This nomination seeks to apply the long-term stable WP:ENGVAR-derived convention to defer to the usage of the top-level country category's creator, which is 'organisations' in all listed below. The countries in this particular nom are in Europe. Oculi (talk) 13:38, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

{{cot| Germany per :Category:Organisations based in Germany (7 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Austria per :Category:Organisations based in Austria (5 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Italy per :Category:Organisations based in Italy (7 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Kosovo per :Category:Organisations based in Kosovo (4 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Spain per :Category:Organisations based in Spain (7 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Switzerland per :Category:Organisations based in Switzerland (5 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| the Netherlands per :Category:Organisations based in the Netherlands (7 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Ukraine per :Category:Organisations based in Ukraine (25 cases)}}

{{cob}}

  • Oppose. For goodness sake, centralise the discussion at RFC. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:35, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose. Why should standardisation, or standardization, by country take precendence over standardization in the subject heirarchies?Rathfelder (talk) 07:52, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • That's easy: there is strong and consistent pattern of precedents to do so. – Fayenatic London 12:32, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Unhelpful practises can last for a long time, but that's no reason to continue. It's long past time to call a halt to such futile piecemeal exercises, and have an RFC to try to explicitly agree an overall approach. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 23:26, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • If there was really a strong and consistent pattern we wouldn't be having this discussion. What there is in reality is a confused and timewasting mess. Time we were BOLD and sorted it out.Rathfelder (talk) 16:54, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support per WP:ENGVAR and in the spirit of WP:C2C, although I regret the opportunity is not taken to move all non-English speaking countries to z. Admittedly that would require a change in WP:ENGVAR. Standardisation in the subject hierarchies taking precedence over standardization by country would also require a change in WP:ENGVAR for that matter. So for these countries I can see the point of having an RFC but that should not affect these nominations which do not require a change in WP:ENGVAR. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:55, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

:* One would not wish to court controversy. Perhaps next time, after the RFC. Oculi (talk) 01:52, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Support most. English is an official language of the European Union. As Ireland is not leaving, it will remain so; no doubt British English with the S-spelling, because Ireland uses British English. Furthermore, in several countries the S-spelling will reflect that of their own language (and Latin, from which the word comes). I am not sure about Kosovo and Ukraine and will abstain on them. Peterkingiron (talk) 19:20, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose Ukraine, reluctant support for others. I would suggest that Ukraine should go the other way; we should use/retain the more widely-accepted "z" spelling wherever there are no strong national reasons to do otherwise. ENGVAR does not state that WP:RETAIN is binding on category hierarchies. The others are right in principle, as odd-ones-out within the national hierarchies, but let's hold an RFC on the whole hierarchy. – Fayenatic London 11:11, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Why do we have :Category:Organisations based in Slovakia but :Category:Organizations based in Slovenia? Rathfelder (talk) 19:27, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Agree that there is little logic behind this. But we can always convert a whole country from s to z or vice versa. Ultimately I would favour to have (at least) all non-English speaking countries consistently at either z or s. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:32, 10 November 2018 (UTC)

::*That would help quite a lot. My problem is that if I am working on, for example :Category:Journalism organizations, which needs splitting by countries, I have no quick way of telling whether I am supposed to use s or z. Rathfelder (talk) 08:33, 10 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Oppose. Where is the precedent for applying STRONGNAT to cats? I thought the precedent was to leave it alone and introduce redirects. Each of these cats is an intersection by country and topic, so not seeing the strength of the "national ties" that would warrant using the English variant very loosely associated with the country. Without linked precedent, RFC sounds like the right move. (not watching, please {{tl|ping}}) czar 17:46, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Organization to organisation (other) ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: no consensus. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:43, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Organizations based in Port-au-Prince to :Category:Organisations based in Port-au-Prince per :Category:Organisations based in Haiti etc.

:Nominator's rationale: This nomination seeks to apply the long-term stable WP:ENGVAR-derived convention to defer to the usage of the top-level country category's creator, which is 'organisations' in all listed below. The countries in this particular nom have no particular links with or proximity to the UK. Oculi (talk) 13:17, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

{{cot| Haiti per :Category:Organisations based in Haiti (7 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Iraq per :Category:Organisations based in Iraq (7 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Nepal per :Category:Organisations based in Nepal (5 cases)}}

{{cob}}

{{cot| Saudi Arabia per :Category:Organisations based in Saudi Arabia (5 cases)}}

{{cob}}

  • Oppose. the idea that these spellings are derived from a long-term stable WP:ENGVAR-derived convention is a delusion. Rathfelder (talk) 07:53, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

:* That idea has not been suggested. :Category:Organisations based in Iraq was created by User:Brammen in 2006 and the long-standing convention (enshrined as a WP:C2C speedy condition) within the category is to defer to the creator (or bring the whole category to cfd if it is thought that there is a compelling reason for Iraq to use 'z'). The rough idea is that {{cl|United Kingdom}} say should use Br Eng within it (colour not color, Association football not soccer, transport not transportation, organisation not organization (as we are no longer in 1963) and many others). Oculi (talk) 10:44, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Support per WP:ENGVAR and in the spirit of WP:C2C, although I regret the opportunity is not taken to move all non-English speaking countries to z. Admittedly that would require a change in WP:ENGVAR. Standardisation in the subject hierarchies taking precedence over standardization by country would also require a change in WP:ENGVAR for that matter. So for these countries I can see the point of having an RFC but that should not affect these nominations which do not require a change in WP:ENGVAR. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:55, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • WP:ENGVAR doesnt say anything explicit about categorisation. Most of these subject/country classifications dont have articles of their own. It does say "For an international encyclopaedia, using vocabulary common to all varieties of English is preferable." "organizations" is common to all varieties of English as far as I can see. Nobody has shown me any policy which says that standardisation by country should take precedence over standardization by subjects when there is no local variant of English in play.Rathfelder (talk) 22:24, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

:* If I understand correctly (but you probably know better than me), writing with a 'z' in British English is correct but archaic. If most British Wikipedians would be okay with a 'z' on Wikipedia, that would be even better, obviously, but so far I haven't seen a consensus on that. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:01, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

  • I dont think archaic is quite the right word. In English there is no language regulator as there is in some countries. Arguably the nearest thing we have is the Oxford English Dictionary, and that deliberately takes a historical view of language. It favours spelling with a z, even today, on historical grounds. See Oxford spelling. My conclusion, and I might say English language is the only thing I am officially qualified to pontificate about, is that there is no justification for condemning "organization" as improper English. It's certainly true that "organisation" is more common in the UK, and its certainly what I would normally use, but its hard to see that as a justification for a big row. Spelling changes over time and place. It's not as though any English speakers, anywhere, would not recognise the word. My guess is that spelling checkers, which generally default to American, are probably altering usage across the globe. Rathfelder (talk) 20:59, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose per Rathfelder. Shuffling around the location of the inconsistencies in this tree is pointless, when the "s" spelling is not even the clear long-term preference of any country. Time to just standardise of "organizations". --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 23:03, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Mixed -- Support Nepal, which will follow India; and Haiti: I think Haiti speaks French, so that it will probably follow it in issuing S. Unsure about Iraq (which had a British mandate after WWI) or Saudi Arabia. Peterkingiron (talk) 19:25, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Reluctant support. These are right in principle, as odd-ones-out within the national hierarchies. But please, let's hold an RFC on the whole hierarchy. – Fayenatic London 11:10, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose. Where is the precedent for applying STRONGNAT to cats? I thought the precedent was to leave it alone and introduce redirects. Each of these cats is an intersection by country and topic, so not seeing the strength of the "national ties" that would warrant using the English variant very loosely associated with the country. Without linked precedent, RFC sounds like the right move. (not watching, please {{tl|ping}}) czar 17:47, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Egyptian revolutionists ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Merge. Timrollpickering 18:36, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:Egyptian revolutionists to :Category:Egyptian revolutionaries

:Nominator's rationale: This could be speedied as WP:C2C per :Category:Revolutionaries by nationality, but I am listing it here in case there is some reason to make a distinction between revolutionists and revolutionaries. BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:30, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:17th-century Dukes of Normandy ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: {{relisted}} at 2018 NOV 13 CFD. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:32, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{Lc|17th-century Dukes of Normandy}}

:Nominator's rationale: This category will only ever contain one person and that person is neither a Frenchman nor a ruler of Normandy. Consequently, it can be upmerged to :Category:Dukes of Normandy. Celia Homeford (talk) 10:06, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Comment It was a title in the peerage of France and was not even included in :Category:Dukes of Normandy. Dimadick (talk) 10:09, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Delete per nom without upmerging, because the one person in this category didn't actually rule Normandy, it was just a title. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:49, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Keep To cover the history of the title across centuries. Dimadick (talk) 07:40, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

----

:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Tony Burrows songs ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: withdrawn and resolved as discussed. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:29, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{Lc|Tony Burrows songs}}

:Nominator's rationale: Strange one this. This category contains songs were Burrows sang, NOT songs where he was the named artist. Many are where he is nominally a 'member of a band' put together to support the single. Some he may not have even sung on.

Not opposed to a list of songs Tony Burrows has sung on - which would be much wider and longer than a category.

This category name is misleading. Richhoncho (talk) 09:34, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

: Oppose: Melanie Makes Me Smile is a Tony Burrows song with him as the named artist so accurately fits this Cat.--Egghead06 (talk) 12:18, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

:*{{ping|Egghead06}}. Fair enough. Trim all the other songs out of the cat and retract delete nom? --Richhoncho (talk) 13:14, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

::I'd go with that. Songs where he was the lead singer in a group really don't belong in this cat.--Egghead06 (talk) 14:51, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

:::Having just one song in the category would totally defeat the purpose. Categories are intended to lead the reader to other closely related articles. Perhaps including the songs on which he is the lead singer of a group but removing the songs on which he is just a backing vocalist would be the better thing to do. - 172.85.246.94 (talk) 14:28, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

  • All songs listed which did not contain Tony Burrows as the artist now removed, leaving only Melanie Make Me Smile. Delete nomination withrawn. --Richhoncho (talk) 10:56, 7 November 2018 (UTC)----

:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Swaziland ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Rename all except those removed from the list by the discussion. Timrollpickering 10:16, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* :Category:Swaziland to :Category:Eswatini

{{collapse top|434 subcats of :Category:Swaziland}}

:* :Category:Swaziland-related lists to :Category:Eswatini-related lists

:* :Category:Buildings and structures in Swaziland to :Category:Buildings and structures in Eswatini

:* :Category:Economy of Swaziland to :Category:Economy of Eswatini

:* :Category:Education in Swaziland to :Category:Education in Eswatini

:* :Category:Environment of Swaziland to :Category:Environment of Eswatini

:* :Category:Geography of Swaziland to :Category:Geography of Eswatini

:* :Category:Government of Swaziland to :Category:Government of Eswatini

:* :Category:Health in Swaziland to :Category:Health in Eswatini

:* :Category:History of Swaziland to :Category:History of Eswatini

:* :Category:Organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Politics of Swaziland to :Category:Politics of Eswatini

:* :Category:Swaziland stubs to :Category:Eswatini stubs

:* :Category:Lists of biota of Swaziland to :Category:Lists of biota of Eswatini

:* :Category:Lists of buildings and structures in Swaziland to :Category:Lists of buildings and structures in Eswatini

:* :Category:Swaziland communications-related lists to :Category:Eswatini communications-related lists

:* :Category:Swaziland diplomacy-related lists to :Category:Eswatini diplomacy-related lists

:* :Category:Economy of Swaziland-related lists to :Category:Economy of Eswatini-related lists

:* :Category:Swaziland education-related lists to :Category:Eswatini education-related lists

:* :Category:Swaziland geography-related lists to :Category:Eswatini geography-related lists

:* :Category:Lists of organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Lists of organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Swaziland sport-related lists to :Category:Eswatini sport-related lists

:* :Category:Swaziland transport-related lists to :Category:Eswatini transport-related lists

:* :Category:Lists of companies of Swaziland to :Category:Lists of companies of Eswatini

:* :Category:Lists of landforms of Swaziland to :Category:Lists of landforms of Eswatini

:* :Category:Buildings and structures in Swaziland by condition to :Category:Buildings and structures in Eswatini by condition

:* :Category:Buildings and structures in Swaziland by type to :Category:Buildings and structures in Eswatini by type

:* :Category:Former buildings and structures in Swaziland to :Category:Former buildings and structures in Eswatini

:* :Category:Archaeological sites in Swaziland to :Category:Archaeological sites in Eswatini

:* :Category:Dams in Swaziland to :Category:Dams in Eswatini

:* :Category:Entertainment venues in Swaziland to :Category:Entertainment venues in Eswatini

:* :Category:Hospitals in Swaziland to :Category:Hospitals in Eswatini

:* :Category:Hotels in Swaziland to :Category:Hotels in Eswatini

:* :Category:Industrial buildings in Swaziland to :Category:Industrial buildings in Eswatini

:* :Category:Museums in Swaziland to :Category:Museums in Eswatini

:* :Category:Places of worship in Swaziland to :Category:Places of worship in Eswatini

:* :Category:Schools in Swaziland to :Category:Schools in Eswatini

:* :Category:Transport buildings and structures in Swaziland to :Category:Transport buildings and structures in Eswatini

:* :Category:Universities and colleges in Swaziland to :Category:Universities and colleges in Eswatini

:* :Category:Casinos in Swaziland to :Category:Casinos in Eswatini

:* :Category:Sports venues in Swaziland to :Category:Sports venues in Eswatini

:* :Category:Athletics (track and field) venues in Swaziland to :Category:Athletics (track and field) venues in Eswatini

:* :Category:Football venues in Swaziland to :Category:Football venues in Eswatini

:* :Category:Power stations in Swaziland to :Category:Power stations in Eswatini

:* :Category:Art museums and galleries in Swaziland to :Category:Art museums and galleries in Eswatini

:* :Category:Churches in Swaziland to :Category:Churches in Eswatini

:* :Category:Cathedrals in Swaziland to :Category:Cathedrals in Eswatini

:* :Category:Roman Catholic churches in Swaziland to :Category:Roman Catholic churches in Eswatini

:* :Category:Roman Catholic cathedrals in Swaziland to :Category:Roman Catholic cathedrals in Eswatini

:* :Category:Alumni by secondary school in Swaziland to :Category:Alumni by secondary school in Eswatini

:* :Category:International Baccalaureate schools in Swaziland to :Category:International Baccalaureate schools in Eswatini

:* :Category:Airports in Swaziland to :Category:Airports in Eswatini

:* :Category:Alumni by university or college in Swaziland to :Category:Alumni by university or college in Eswatini

:* :Category:Cinema of Swaziland to :Category:Cinema of Eswatini

:* :Category:Entertainment in Swaziland to :Category:Entertainment in Eswatini

:* :Category:Events in Swaziland to :Category:Events in Eswatini

:* :Category:Cultural festivals in Swaziland to :Category:Cultural festivals in Eswatini

:* :Category:Films set in Swaziland to :Category:Films set in Eswatini

:* :Category:Languages of Swaziland to :Category:Languages of Eswatini

:* :Category:Media in Swaziland to :Category:Media in Eswatini

:* :Category:National symbols of Swaziland to :Category:National symbols of Eswatini

:* :Category:Religion in Swaziland to :Category:Religion in Eswatini

:* :Category:Sport in Swaziland to :Category:Sport in Eswatini

:* :Category:Orders, decorations, and medals of Swaziland to :Category:Orders, decorations, and medals of Eswatini

:* :Category:Films shot in Swaziland to :Category:Films shot in Eswatini

:* :Category:Entertainment events in Swaziland to :Category:Entertainment events in Eswatini

:* :Category:Gambling in Swaziland to :Category:Gambling in Eswatini

:* :Category:Radio in Swaziland to :Category:Radio in Eswatini

:* :Category:Television in Swaziland to :Category:Television in Eswatini

:* :Category:Festivals in Swaziland to :Category:Festivals in Eswatini

:* :Category:Sports competitions in Swaziland to :Category:Sports competitions in Eswatini

:* :Category:International sports competitions hosted by Swaziland to :Category:International sports competitions hosted by Eswatini

:* :Category:Football competitions in Swaziland to :Category:Football competitions in Eswatini

:* :Category:Golf tournaments in Swaziland to :Category:Golf tournaments in Eswatini

:* :Category:Sports leagues in Swaziland to :Category:Sports leagues in Eswatini

:* :Category:Football leagues in Swaziland to :Category:Football leagues in Eswatini

:* :Category:Radio stations in Swaziland to :Category:Radio stations in Eswatini

:* :Category:Television organisations in Swaziland to :Category:Television organisations in Eswatini

:* :Category:Television companies of Swaziland to :Category:Television companies of Eswatini

:* :Category:Annual events in Swaziland to :Category:Annual events in Eswatini

:* :Category:Ceremonies in Swaziland to :Category:Ceremonies in Eswatini

:* :Category:Disestablishments in Swaziland to :Category:Disestablishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:Establishments in Swaziland to :Category:Establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:Disestablishments in Swaziland by century to :Category:Disestablishments in Eswatini by century

:* :Category:Disestablishments in Swaziland by decade to :Category:Disestablishments in Eswatini by decade

:* :Category:Disestablishments in Swaziland by millennium to :Category:Disestablishments in Eswatini by millennium

:* :Category:Disestablishments in Swaziland by year to :Category:Disestablishments in Eswatini by year

:* :Category:2nd-millennium disestablishments in Swaziland to :Category:2nd-millennium disestablishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:Establishments in Swaziland by century to :Category:Establishments in Eswatini by century

:* :Category:Establishments in Swaziland by decade to :Category:Establishments in Eswatini by decade

:* :Category:Establishments in Swaziland by millennium to :Category:Establishments in Eswatini by millennium

:* :Category:Establishments in Swaziland by year to :Category:Establishments in Eswatini by year

:* :Category:21st-century establishments in Swaziland to :Category:21st-century establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2nd-millennium establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2nd-millennium establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:3rd-millennium establishments in Swaziland to :Category:3rd-millennium establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:Media companies of Swaziland to :Category:Media companies of Eswatini

:* :Category:Newspapers published in Swaziland to :Category:Newspapers published in Eswatini

:* :Category:Music organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Music organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Christianity in Swaziland to :Category:Christianity in Eswatini

:* :Category:Religious leaders in Swaziland to :Category:Religious leaders in Eswatini

:* :Category:Catholic Church in Swaziland to :Category:Catholic Church in Eswatini

:* :Category:Christian clergy in Swaziland to :Category:Christian clergy in Eswatini

:* :Category:Christian denominations in Swaziland to :Category:Christian denominations in Eswatini

:* :Category:Christian missionaries in Swaziland to :Category:Christian missionaries in Eswatini

:* :Category:Protestantism in Swaziland to :Category:Protestantism in Eswatini

:* :Category:Roman Catholic dioceses in Swaziland to :Category:Roman Catholic dioceses in Eswatini

:* :Category:Anglicanism in Swaziland to :Category:Anglicanism in Eswatini

:* :Category:Anglican missionaries in Swaziland to :Category:Anglican missionaries in Eswatini

:* :Category:Protestant missionaries in Swaziland to :Category:Protestant missionaries in Eswatini

:* :Category:Sport in Swaziland by sport to :Category:Sport in Eswatini by sport

:* :Category:Sports teams in Swaziland to :Category:Sports teams in Eswatini

:* :Category:Swaziland at multi-sport events to :Category:Eswatini at multi-sport events

:* :Category:Men's sport in Swaziland to :Category:Men's sport in Eswatini

:* :Category:Women's sport in Swaziland to :Category:Women's sport in Eswatini

:* :Category:Expatriate sportspeople in Swaziland to :Category:Expatriate sportspeople in Eswatini

:* :Category:Sports governing bodies in Swaziland to :Category:Sports governing bodies in Eswatini

:* :Category:Sports organisations of Swaziland to :Category:Sports organisations of Eswatini

:* :Category:Youth sport in Swaziland to :Category:Youth sport in Eswatini

:* :Category:Athletics in Swaziland to :Category:Athletics in Eswatini

:* :Category:Basketball in Swaziland to :Category:Basketball in Eswatini

:* :Category:Boxing in Swaziland to :Category:Boxing in Eswatini

:* :Category:Cricket in Swaziland to :Category:Cricket in Eswatini

:* :Category:Diving in Swaziland to :Category:Diving in Eswatini

:* :Category:Football in Swaziland to :Category:Football in Eswatini

:* :Category:Golf in Swaziland to :Category:Golf in Eswatini

:* :Category:Martial arts in Swaziland to :Category:Martial arts in Eswatini

:* :Category:Rugby union in Swaziland to :Category:Rugby union in Eswatini

:* :Category:Running in Swaziland to :Category:Running in Eswatini

:* :Category:Shooting sports in Swaziland to :Category:Shooting sports in Eswatini

:* :Category:Skiing in Swaziland to :Category:Skiing in Eswatini

:* :Category:Swimming in Swaziland to :Category:Swimming in Eswatini

:* :Category:Volleyball in Swaziland to :Category:Volleyball in Eswatini

:* :Category:Water sports in Swaziland to :Category:Water sports in Eswatini

:* :Category:Weightlifting in Swaziland to :Category:Weightlifting in Eswatini

:* :Category:Football people in Swaziland to :Category:Football people in Eswatini

:* :Category:Wikipedia categories named after football clubs in Swaziland to :Category:Wikipedia categories named after football clubs in Eswatini

:* :Category:Footballers in Swaziland to :Category:Footballers in Eswatini

:* :Category:Football managers in Swaziland to :Category:Football managers in Eswatini

:* :Category:Expatriate footballers in Swaziland to :Category:Expatriate footballers in Eswatini

:* :Category:Footballers in Swaziland by club to :Category:Footballers in Eswatini by club

:* :Category:Expatriate football managers in Swaziland to :Category:Expatriate football managers in Eswatini

:* :Category:National sports teams of Swaziland to :Category:National sports teams of Eswatini

:* :Category:Women's sports teams in Swaziland to :Category:Women's sports teams in Eswatini

:* :Category:Women's national sports teams of Swaziland to :Category:Women's national sports teams of Eswatini

:* :Category:Banks of Swaziland to :Category:Banks of Eswatini

:* :Category:Business organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Business organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Communications in Swaziland to :Category:Communications in Eswatini

:* :Category:Currencies of Swaziland to :Category:Currencies of Eswatini

:* :Category:Energy in Swaziland to :Category:Energy in Eswatini

:* :Category:Economic history of Swaziland to :Category:Economic history of Eswatini

:* :Category:Industry in Swaziland to :Category:Industry in Eswatini

:* :Category:Infrastructure in Swaziland to :Category:Infrastructure in Eswatini

:* :Category:Labour in Swaziland to :Category:Labour in Eswatini

:* :Category:Mining in Swaziland to :Category:Mining in Eswatini

:* :Category:Retailing in Swaziland to :Category:Retailing in Eswatini

:* :Category:Tourism in Swaziland to :Category:Tourism in Eswatini

:* :Category:Transport in Swaziland to :Category:Transport in Eswatini

:* :Category:Wealth in Swaziland to :Category:Wealth in Eswatini

:* :Category:Companies of Swaziland to :Category:Companies of Eswatini

:* :Category:Companies of Swaziland by industry to :Category:Companies of Eswatini by industry

:* :Category:Defunct companies of Swaziland to :Category:Defunct companies of Eswatini

:* :Category:Railway companies of Swaziland to :Category:Railway companies of Eswatini

:* :Category:Airlines of Swaziland to :Category:Airlines of Eswatini

:* :Category:Defunct airlines of Swaziland to :Category:Defunct airlines of Eswatini

:* :Category:Telecommunications in Swaziland to :Category:Telecommunications in Eswatini

:* :Category:Electric power in Swaziland to :Category:Electric power in Eswatini

:* :Category:Energy infrastructure in Swaziland to :Category:Energy infrastructure in Eswatini

:* :Category:Electric power infrastructure in Swaziland to :Category:Electric power infrastructure in Eswatini

:* :Category:Mines in Swaziland to :Category:Mines in Eswatini

:* :Category:Iron mines in Swaziland to :Category:Iron mines in Eswatini

:* :Category:Transport infrastructure in Swaziland to :Category:Transport infrastructure in Eswatini

:* :Category:Road infrastructure in Swaziland to :Category:Road infrastructure in Eswatini

:* :Category:Roads in Swaziland to :Category:Roads in Eswatini

:* :Category:Trade unions in Swaziland to :Category:Trade unions in Eswatini

:* :Category:Tourist attractions in Swaziland to :Category:Tourist attractions in Eswatini

:* :Category:Historic sites in Swaziland to :Category:Historic sites in Eswatini

:* :Category:Protected areas of Swaziland to :Category:Protected areas of Eswatini

:* :Category:Heritage registers in Swaziland to :Category:Heritage registers in Eswatini

:* :Category:National parks of Swaziland to :Category:National parks of Eswatini

:* :Category:Ramsar sites in Swaziland to :Category:Ramsar sites in Eswatini

:* :Category:Aviation in Swaziland to :Category:Aviation in Eswatini

:* :Category:Transport organisations in Swaziland to :Category:Transport organisations in Eswatini

:* :Category:Rail transport in Swaziland to :Category:Rail transport in Eswatini

:* :Category:Road transport in Swaziland to :Category:Road transport in Eswatini

:* :Category:People by educational institution in Swaziland to :Category:People by educational institution in Eswatini

:* :Category:Academia in Swaziland to :Category:Academia in Eswatini

:* :Category:Biota of Swaziland to :Category:Biota of Eswatini

:* :Category:Conservation in Swaziland to :Category:Conservation in Eswatini

:* :Category:Ecoregions of Swaziland to :Category:Ecoregions of Eswatini

:* :Category:Environmentalism in Swaziland to :Category:Environmentalism in Eswatini

:* :Category:Natural history of Swaziland to :Category:Natural history of Eswatini

:* :Category:Water in Swaziland to :Category:Water in Eswatini

:* :Category:Fauna of Swaziland to :Category:Fauna of Eswatini

:* :Category:Flora of Swaziland to :Category:Flora of Eswatini

:* :Category:Arthropods of Swaziland to :Category:Arthropods of Eswatini

:* :Category:Vertebrates of Swaziland to :Category:Vertebrates of Eswatini

:* :Category:Insects of Swaziland to :Category:Insects of Eswatini

:* :Category:Fish of Swaziland to :Category:Fish of Eswatini

:* :Category:Mammals of Swaziland to :Category:Mammals of Eswatini

:* :Category:Reptiles of Swaziland to :Category:Reptiles of Eswatini

:* :Category:Geology of Swaziland to :Category:Geology of Eswatini

:* :Category:Earthquakes in Swaziland to :Category:Earthquakes in Eswatini

:* :Category:Bodies of water of Swaziland to :Category:Bodies of water of Eswatini

:* :Category:Wetlands of Swaziland to :Category:Wetlands of Eswatini

:* :Category:Rivers of Swaziland to :Category:Rivers of Eswatini

:* :Category:Springs of Swaziland to :Category:Springs of Eswatini

:* :Category:Hot Springs of Swaziland to :Category:Hot Springs of Eswatini

:* :Category:Borders of Swaziland to :Category:Borders of Eswatini

:* :Category:Landforms of Swaziland to :Category:Landforms of Eswatini

:* :Category:Natural disasters in Swaziland to :Category:Natural disasters in Eswatini

:* :Category:Populated places in Swaziland to :Category:Populated places in Eswatini

:* :Category:Subdivisions of Swaziland to :Category:Subdivisions of Eswatini

:* :Category:Swaziland geography stubs to :Category:Eswatini geography stubs

:* :Category:Border crossings of Swaziland to :Category:Border crossings of Eswatini

:* :Category:Mountains of Swaziland to :Category:Mountains of Eswatini

:* :Category:Valleys of Swaziland to :Category:Valleys of Eswatini

:* :Category:Populated places in Swaziland by region to :Category:Populated places in Eswatini by region

:* :Category:Regions of Swaziland to :Category:Regions of Eswatini

:* :Category:People by region in Swaziland to :Category:People by region in Eswatini

:* :Category:Foreign relations of Swaziland to :Category:Foreign relations of Eswatini

:* :Category:Government ministries of Swaziland to :Category:Government ministries of Eswatini

:* :Category:Government ministers of Swaziland to :Category:Government ministers of Eswatini

:* :Category:Penal system in Swaziland to :Category:Penal system in Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors of Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors to Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors to Eswatini

:* :Category:Bilateral relations of Swaziland to :Category:Bilateral relations of Eswatini

:* :Category:Swaziland and the Commonwealth of Nations to :Category:Eswatini and the Commonwealth of Nations

:* :Category:Diplomatic missions of Swaziland to :Category:Diplomatic missions of Eswatini

:* :Category:Expatriate judges on the courts of Swaziland to :Category:Expatriate judges on the courts of Eswatini

:* :Category:Foreign Ministers of Swaziland to :Category:Foreign Ministers of Eswatini

:* :Category:Treaties of Swaziland to :Category:Treaties of Eswatini

:* :Category:United Nations Security Council resolutions concerning Swaziland to :Category:United Nations Security Council resolutions concerning Eswatini

:* :Category:Wars involving Swaziland to :Category:Wars involving Eswatini

:* :Category:Lists of ambassadors of Swaziland to :Category:Lists of ambassadors of Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of Swaziland to the European Union to :Category:Ambassadors of Eswatini to the European Union

:* :Category:Ambassadors of Swaziland to South Korea to :Category:Ambassadors of Eswatini to South Korea

:* :Category:Ambassadors of Swaziland to Taiwan to :Category:Ambassadors of Eswatini to Taiwan

:* :Category:High Commissioners to Swaziland to :Category:High Commissioners to Eswatini

:* :Category:Apostolic Nuncios to Swaziland to :Category:Apostolic Nuncios to Eswatini

:* :Category:High Commissioners of Canada to Swaziland to :Category:High Commissioners of Canada to Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of China to Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors of China to Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of Finland to Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors of Finland to Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of France to Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors of France to Eswatini

:* :Category:High Commissioners of Ghana to Swaziland to :Category:High Commissioners of Ghana to Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of Israel to Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors of Israel to Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of Norway to Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors of Norway to Eswatini

:* :Category:Ambassadors of the United States to Swaziland to :Category:Ambassadors of the United States to Eswatini

:* :Category:High Commissioners of the United Kingdom to Swaziland to :Category:High Commissioners of the United Kingdom to Eswatini

:* :Category:Canada–Swaziland relations to :Category:Canada–Eswatini relations

:* :Category:China–Swaziland relations to :Category:China–Eswatini relations

:* :Category:Swaziland–Tunisia relations to :Category:Eswatini–Tunisia relations

:* :Category:Swaziland–United Kingdom relations to :Category:Eswatini–United Kingdom relations

:* :Category:Swaziland–United States relations to :Category:Eswatini–United States relations

:* :Category:Chinese expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Chinese expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Malawian expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Malawian expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Malawian judges on the courts of Swaziland to :Category:Malawian judges on the courts of Eswatini

:* :Category:South African judges on the courts of Swaziland to :Category:South African judges on the courts of Eswatini

:* :Category:South African expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:South African expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:South African emigrants to Swaziland to :Category:South African emigrants to Eswatini

:* :Category:Botswana judges on the courts of Swaziland to :Category:Botswana judges on the courts of Eswatini

:* :Category:Ghanaian judges on the courts of Swaziland to :Category:Ghanaian judges on the courts of Eswatini

:* :Category:Lesotho judges on the courts of Swaziland to :Category:Lesotho judges on the courts of Eswatini

:* :Category:Nigerian judges on the courts of Swaziland to :Category:Nigerian judges on the courts of Eswatini

:* :Category:Women government ministers of Swaziland to :Category:Women government ministers of Eswatini

:* :Category:Crime in Swaziland to :Category:Crime in Eswatini

:* :Category:Human rights in Swaziland to :Category:Human rights in Eswatini

:* :Category:Law enforcement in Swaziland to :Category:Law enforcement in Eswatini

:* :Category:Prisoners and detainees of Swaziland to :Category:Prisoners and detainees of Eswatini

:* :Category:Amnesty International prisoners of conscience held by Swaziland to :Category:Amnesty International prisoners of conscience held by Eswatini

:* :Category:Women's rights in Swaziland to :Category:Women's rights in Eswatini

:* :Category:Death in Swaziland to :Category:Death in Eswatini

:* :Category:Drugs in Swaziland to :Category:Drugs in Eswatini

:* :Category:Food and drink in Swaziland to :Category:Food and drink in Eswatini

:* :Category:Medical and health organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Medical and health organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Deaths in Swaziland to :Category:Deaths in Eswatini

:* :Category:Suicides in Swaziland to :Category:Suicides in Eswatini

:* :Category:History of Swaziland by period to :Category:History of Eswatini by period

:* :Category:History of Swaziland by topic to :Category:History of Eswatini by topic

:* :Category:Defunct organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Defunct organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Disasters in Swaziland to :Category:Disasters in Eswatini

:* :Category:Elections in Swaziland to :Category:Elections in Eswatini

:* :Category:Centuries in Swaziland to :Category:Centuries in Eswatini

:* :Category:Decades in Swaziland to :Category:Decades in Eswatini

:* :Category:Millennia in Swaziland to :Category:Millennia in Eswatini

:* :Category:Years in Swaziland to :Category:Years in Eswatini

:* :Category:21st century in Swaziland to :Category:21st century in Eswatini

:* :Category:Years of the 21st century in Swaziland to :Category:Years of the 21st century in Eswatini

:* :Category:2018 in Swaziland to :Category:2018 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2019 in Swaziland to :Category:2019 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2nd millennium in Swaziland to :Category:2nd millennium in Eswatini

:* :Category:3rd millennium in Swaziland to :Category:3rd millennium in Eswatini

:* :Category:Man-made disasters in Swaziland to :Category:Man-made disasters in Eswatini

:* :Category:Referendums in Swaziland to :Category:Referendums in Eswatini

:* :Category:Charities based in Swaziland to :Category:Charities based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Child-related organisations in Swaziland to :Category:Child-related organisations in Eswatini

:* :Category:Environmental organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Environmental organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Political organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Political organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Student organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Student organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Women's organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Women's organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Wikipedia categories named after organisations based in Swaziland to :Category:Wikipedia categories named after organisations based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Children's charities based in Swaziland to :Category:Children's charities based in Eswatini

:* :Category:Scouting and Guiding in Swaziland to :Category:Scouting and Guiding in Eswatini

:* :Category:Political parties in Swaziland to :Category:Political parties in Eswatini

:* :Category:People by city in Swaziland to :Category:People by city in Eswatini

:* :Category:Expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Immigrants to Swaziland to :Category:Immigrants to Eswatini

:* :Category:Botswana expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Botswana expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:German expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:German expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Ghanaian expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Ghanaian expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Lesotho expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Lesotho expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Nigerian expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Nigerian expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Pakistani expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Pakistani expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Swedish expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Swedish expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Zimbabwean expatriates in Swaziland to :Category:Zimbabwean expatriates in Eswatini

:* :Category:Mozambican emigrants to Swaziland to :Category:Mozambican emigrants to Eswatini

:* :Category:Political office-holders in Swaziland to :Category:Political office-holders in Eswatini

:* :Category:Naturalized citizens of Swaziland to :Category:Naturalized citizens of Eswatini

:* :Category:Political movements in Swaziland to :Category:Political movements in Eswatini

:* :Category:Ethnic groups in Swaziland to :Category:Ethnic groups in Eswatini

:* :Category:Foreign charities operating in Swaziland to :Category:Foreign charities operating in Eswatini

:* :Category:Gender in Swaziland to :Category:Gender in Eswatini

:* :Category:Women in Swaziland to :Category:Women in Eswatini

:* :Category:Youth in Swaziland to :Category:Youth in Eswatini

:* :Category:Men in Swaziland to :Category:Men in Eswatini

{{collapse bottom}}

; Categories struck from this list per suggestions in the discussion below

:* :Category:Treaties extended to Swaziland (protectorate) to :Category:Treaties extended to Eswatini (protectorate)

:* :Category:Endemic fauna of Swaziland to :Category:Endemic fauna of Eswatini

:* :Category:20th century in Swaziland to :Category:20th century in Eswatini

:* :Category:Years of the 20th century in Swaziland to :Category:Years of the 20th century in Eswatini

:* :Category:20th-century disestablishments in Swaziland to :Category:20th-century disestablishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:20th-century establishments in Swaziland to :Category:20th-century establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1970s disestablishments in Swaziland to :Category:1970s disestablishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1973 disestablishments in Swaziland to :Category:1973 disestablishments in Eswatini

{{collapse top|plus about ~95 years/decades categories from before 2018}}

:* :Category:1900s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1900s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1950s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1950s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1960s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1960s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1970s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1970s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1980s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1980s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1990s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1990s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1908 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1908 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1952 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1952 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1957 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1957 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1963 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1963 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1964 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1964 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1965 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1965 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1968 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1968 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1971 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1971 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1974 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1974 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1976 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1976 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1978 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1978 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1979 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1979 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1980 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1980 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1982 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1982 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1983 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1983 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1985 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1985 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1987 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1987 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1990 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1990 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1994 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1994 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1995 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1995 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1999 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:1999 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2000s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2000s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2010s establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2010s establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2000 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2000 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2001 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2001 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2002 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2002 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2003 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2003 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2005 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2005 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2006 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2006 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2007 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2007 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2008 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2008 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2009 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2009 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2012 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2012 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:2013 establishments in Swaziland to :Category:2013 establishments in Eswatini

:* :Category:1900s in Swaziland to :Category:1900s in Eswatini

:* :Category:1950s in Swaziland to :Category:1950s in Eswatini

:* :Category:1960s in Swaziland to :Category:1960s in Eswatini

:* :Category:1970s in Swaziland to :Category:1970s in Eswatini

:* :Category:1980s in Swaziland to :Category:1980s in Eswatini

:* :Category:1990s in Swaziland to :Category:1990s in Eswatini

:* :Category:1908 in Swaziland to :Category:1908 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1952 in Swaziland to :Category:1952 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1957 in Swaziland to :Category:1957 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1962 in Swaziland to :Category:1962 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1963 in Swaziland to :Category:1963 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1964 in Swaziland to :Category:1964 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1965 in Swaziland to :Category:1965 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1967 in Swaziland to :Category:1967 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1968 in Swaziland to :Category:1968 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1972 in Swaziland to :Category:1972 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1973 in Swaziland to :Category:1973 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1971 in Swaziland to :Category:1971 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1974 in Swaziland to :Category:1974 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1976 in Swaziland to :Category:1976 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1978 in Swaziland to :Category:1978 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1979 in Swaziland to :Category:1979 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1982 in Swaziland to :Category:1982 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1980 in Swaziland to :Category:1980 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1983 in Swaziland to :Category:1983 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1985 in Swaziland to :Category:1985 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1987 in Swaziland to :Category:1987 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1990 in Swaziland to :Category:1990 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1994 in Swaziland to :Category:1994 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1995 in Swaziland to :Category:1995 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1999 in Swaziland to :Category:1999 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1992 in Swaziland to :Category:1992 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1993 in Swaziland to :Category:1993 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1996 in Swaziland to :Category:1996 in Eswatini

:* :Category:1998 in Swaziland to :Category:1998 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2000 in Swaziland to :Category:2000 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2000s in Swaziland to :Category:2000s in Eswatini

:* :Category:2010s in Swaziland to :Category:2010s in Eswatini

:* :Category:2001 in Swaziland to :Category:2001 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2002 in Swaziland to :Category:2002 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2003 in Swaziland to :Category:2003 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2004 in Swaziland to :Category:2004 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2005 in Swaziland to :Category:2005 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2006 in Swaziland to :Category:2006 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2007 in Swaziland to :Category:2007 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2008 in Swaziland to :Category:2008 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2009 in Swaziland to :Category:2009 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2010 in Swaziland to :Category:2010 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2011 in Swaziland to :Category:2011 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2012 in Swaziland to :Category:2012 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2013 in Swaziland to :Category:2013 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2014 in Swaziland to :Category:2014 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2015 in Swaziland to :Category:2015 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2016 in Swaziland to :Category:2016 in Eswatini

:* :Category:2017 in Swaziland to :Category:2017 in Eswatini

{{collapse bottom}}

;Changes to word order per suggestion by Good Olfactory in the discussion below

{{collapse top|strike out 8 international relations categories where the new name also needs a new word order}}

:* :Category:Mozambique–Swaziland border to :Category:Mozambique–Eswatini border

:* :Category:South Africa–Swaziland border to :Category:South Africa–Eswatini border

:* :Category:Mozambique–Swaziland border crossings to :Category:Mozambique–Eswatini border crossings

:* :Category:South Africa–Swaziland border crossings to :Category:South Africa–Eswatini border crossings

:* :Category:Holy See–Swaziland relations to :Category:Holy See–Eswatini relations

:* :Category:Malawi–Swaziland relations to :Category:Malawi–Eswatini relations

:* :Category:Mozambique–Swaziland relations to :Category:Mozambique–Eswatini relations

:* :Category:South Africa–Swaziland relations to :Category:South Africa–Eswatini relations

{{collapse bottom}}

{{collapse top|new listings for 8 international relations categories with corrected word order}}

:*:Category:Mozambique–Swaziland border to :Category:Eswatini–Mozambique border

:*:Category:South Africa–Swaziland border to :Category:Eswatini–South Africa border

:*:Category:Mozambique–Swaziland border crossings to :Category:Eswatini–Mozambique border crossings

:*:Category:South Africa–Swaziland border crossings to :Category:Eswatini–South Africa border crossings

:*:Category:Holy See–Swaziland relations to :Category:Eswatini–Holy See relations

:*:Category:Malawi–Swaziland relations to :Category:Eswatini–Malawi relations

:*:Category:Mozambique–Swaziland relations to :Category:Eswatini–Mozambique relations

:*:Category:South Africa–Swaziland relations to :Category:Eswatini–South Africa relations

{{collapse bottom}}

:Nominator's rationale. the head article for this small African country has been moved from {{noredirect|Swaziland}} to Eswatini, per two RM discusisons (RM 12 October 2018 to "eSwatini", then RM 24 October 2018 to the conventionally-categorised form "Eswatini").

:Category names should follow the country name, so this nomination is a first step on that path. To simplify matters, I have tried to take only the simplest and most clearcut cases, as follows case as the first step: i.e. those which:

:# use the full word "Swaziland", and not the demonym "Swazi" (so :Category:Swazi people etc)

:# are clearly a descriptive title per WP:NDESC, i.e. a phrase such as :Category:Organisations based in Swaziland which as been invented by en.wp editors to describe a set of articles.

:# are not a proper name (e.g. :Category:University of Swaziland and its subcats)

:# do not approximate the title of a public office (e.g. :Category:Chief Justices of Swaziland)

:# do not refer to the participation of the country in international organisations such as the United Nations, which sometimes uses a name different to he nmae chosen by Wikipedia' naming policies

:# do not refer to a national sports team of the country or to the country's participation in international multi-sport events such as the Olympics, since those sports and events may have their own procedures

:This left a list of 435 categories, out of my AWB-generated list of 721, of which 481 include the word "Swaziland". The other 45 categories which do include the "Swaziland" but which I excluded for the numbered reasons above is listed on a subpage of this one: Swaziland cats not included

:These exclusions are not intended to prejudice future discussions of the other categories. Maybe the others will all be renamed without controversy, or maybe they need to be discussed in smaller sets. But simplifying this list will allow this discussion to focus on the principle, rather than on any exceptions. If you spot any categories listed above which you think should be left for a future discussion, please ping me and I will strike them. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 04:24, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Tagging. Categories all tagged, in [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Contributions/BrownHairedGirl&dir=prev&offset=201811050443&dir=next&limit=436&target=BrownHairedGirl these edit]. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:36, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Notifications. I have notified WikiProject Swaziland,[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2018_November_5&diff=prev&oldid=867405475] WikiProject Africa,[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Africa&diff=prev&oldid=867406227] and :WikiProject_Countries[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Countries&diff=prev&oldid=867406816]. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:49, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • See also the discussion above on template categories, at #Eswatini_templates. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:11, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Note to closing admin: If here is a consensus to rename, then the old pages will be automatically converted into {{tl|Category redirect}}s by the bot which does the moves. Per the discussion below, please keep those redirects. They will help editors and readers who don't know about the new name, and many more who don't know which categories have been renamed. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:18, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

=== Swaziland: Discussion and survey ===

  • Comment. :Category:Treaties extended to Swaziland (protectorate) should not be named to :Category:Treaties extended to Eswatini (protectorate). This category is for treaties that were extended by the UK to the protectorate of Swaziland from 1902–68. During this time, it was called "Swaziland". Good Ol’factory (talk) 07:24, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Good catch, @Good Ol’factory. I have struck that one. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 12:01, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment I've dropped this note on the Eswatini talkpage. Lugnuts Fire Walk with Me 08:22, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment {{ping|BrownHairedGirl}} :Category:Flora of Swaziland should not be moved; "Swaziland" is the term used by the WGSRPD whose geographical divisions are used in describing and categorizing flora distributions. Taxonomic databases all still use "Swaziland" and the WGSRPD standard abbreviation (which may be all that is present in many of them) is "SWZ". The category redirect at :Category:Flora of Eswatini will suffice for now. Peter coxhead (talk) 08:53, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose excluding Category:Flora of Swaziland. It's meaningless how that organization calls the country, as that name is not something special and does not have a historical significance such in Lugnuts example. That category is also a child of :Category:Biota of Swaziland and should follow the same style. --Gonnym (talk) 10:04, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support the proposed exclusion, it does seem to matter here what the organisation uses. Clearly there has been some consensus previously that such "flora" based categories will use the geographical name set from this organisation instead of the common name. See the following list for what I am talking about: List of codes used in the World Geographical Scheme for Recording Plant Distributions. Look specifically at entries such as line 388, where the flora category uses an older name for the region of "Western New Guinea". - Wiz9999 (talk) 11:39, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • {{yo|Peter coxhead}} I have struck :Category:Flora of Swaziland, as you requested.
    {{yo|Gonnym}} you present a reasoned case for renaming this one, but this discussion of 435 categories risks being overwhelmed if we debate the merits of each category where there is an objection which presents a prima facie case for treating it as an exception, as Peter coxhead did here. It is much easier to simply leave it aside for now, without prejudice to a separate discussion later. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 12:11, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Sure (if/when someone chooses to follow this up, ping me). --Gonnym (talk) 12:13, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

:::Yes, that's what I was thinking of - sounds good to me. Thanks. Lugnuts Fire Walk with Me 17:18, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

::::{{yo|Lugnuts}} I will leave a note for the closing admin. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:14, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Oppose mass renaming. The vast majority of articles relate to the time when the country was called Swaziland. Wikipedia has never been in the business of revisionism. I'll clearly be outvoted, but I'm frankly very uncomfortable with this whole business. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:42, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • {{yo|Necrothesp}}. There's no revisionism involved, simply an updating of the label by which we group topics in sets which are not by definition wholly before the name change. As you will see from the discussion above, we have already excluded over 100 categories which relate wholly to the period before the name change.
    Do you want to identify any more such categories? Or are you simply objecting to a country changing its name? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:13, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Now, that's not what I said, is it? But, if you want examples. The ambassador categories. How many of these were ambassadors to or from Eswatini? That's revisionism. The judge categories. How many of these were judges in Eswatini? That too is revisionism. :Category:Political office-holders in Swaziland. How many of these people held office in Eswatini? And many others. The vast majority of the people in these categories held office in Swaziland, not Eswatini. It seems to me that this is an attempt to eliminate the previous name entirely just because the country has decided to change its name. What is wrong with naming these cats "Foo in Eswatini and Swaziland"? That would eliminate all hint of revisionism. -- Necrothesp (talk) 08:42, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • We don't split categories merely according to changes in country name. Granted, there exists :Category:Rhodesian politicians within :Category:Zimbabwean politicians. However, we generally prefer anachronistic categories over splitting the categories where there is not a major change in the national identity, e.g. :Category:Zairean people redirects to :Category:Democratic Republic of the Congo people, and :Category:Prime Ministers of Burkina Faso includes the PMs of Upper Volta (see List). – Fayenatic London 09:46, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • {{yo|Necrothesp}} "Foo in A and B" is a daft name when A and B are synonyms. It implies that A and B are distinct entities, rather than different names for the same thing, and it would break category navigation systems.
    Using your example, :Category:Political office-holders in Swaziland, some will have held office old under the old name, some will hold office only under the new name, and some will hold office under both. Over time, the balance will shift towards B. But all refer to the same entity; there was no change of regime.
    @FL's other example of Rhodesia is a different situation, because while the territorial borders of Rhodesia and Zimbabwe were identical, there was a major shift in regime, so "Rhodesia" marks a distinct era, and is treated as a historical subcat of Zimbabwe. Similarly, :Category:French Third Republic denotes a distinct regime in France, and its subcats are subcats of the equivalent French category. That is different to FL's other example of Zaire/Democratic Republic of the Congo, which was a simple name change. Similarly, changes of name in cities have been accommodated simply by using the new name and keeping redirects, e.g. Salisbury/Harare, Mumbai/Chennai, Calcutta/Kolkata.
    To clarify what has happened, I suggest that we simply add a hatnote to each category saying "Known until 2018 as Swaziland". --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 11:45, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support nomination as revised to date. – Fayenatic London 09:51, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support but historic categories for periods before the name change should be kept (and these changes are now struck through). Parent categories covering all periods should be renamed, but should continue to parent historic Swaziland, e.g. "Swaziland in 2008", because it is exactly the same place. That is what we do for Belgian Congo/Congo-Kinshasa/Zaire/DRC; and Upper Volta/Burkino Faso; and I hope Gold Coast/Ghana. Peterkingiron (talk) 19:31, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Non-talk pages requesting an edit to a protected page ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Rename. Timrollpickering 10:01, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Non-talk pages requesting an edit to a protected page to :Category:Non-talk pages with an edit request template

:Nominator's rationale: Proposing moving to a more accurate name. By nature, people making an edit request can't actually put the template on the article itself since the article is protected. Therefore, any instance of this being on a mainspace, User:, Wikipedia:, Template:, or Help: page is not going to be an edit request. In general, its usage in articles and other non-talk pages seems to consist of misguided attempts at protecting a page by newbies rather than edit requests. cymru.lass (talk • contribs) 03:39, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Support per being more clear/accurate. zchrykng (talk) 03:47, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Support --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 07:19, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Historic hotels in the United States ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Keep for now; revisit if the broader category tree is considered. Timrollpickering 10:12, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{Lc|Historic hotels in the United States}}

:* Propose deleting :Category:Historic bank buildings in the United States - added 20 October

:* Propose deleting :Category:Historic department store buildings in the United States - added 20 October

:* Propose deleting :Category:Historic gas stations in the United States - added 20 October

:* Propose deleting :Category:Historic warehouses in the United States - added 20 October

:Nominator's rationale: delete, the characterization of a hotel as 'historic' is subjective when the hotel is not listed as such. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:20, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

:Comment:: How does the category for historic hotels in the United States differ from the other categories of Historic bank buildings, gas stations, house museums and warehouses in the United States or from the parent category :Category:Historic buildings and structures in the United States; these are all "subjectively" regarded as “historic” but do not have a NRHP or similar local or state listing? Hugo999 (talk) 10:17, 20 October 2018 (UTC)

:* Fair point, I have added four siblings to the nomination. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:02, 20 October 2018 (UTC)

  • Strongly Oppose There is no reason to get rid of these categories, as they do not inherently have to contain historical structures that are not listed as such. To get rid of these categories would be nonsensical. SuperChris (talk) 19:02, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

:* Then what are inclusion criteria? Marcocapelle (talk) 18:21, 2 November 2018 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 07:25, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Teachers colleges ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Merge/rename to "Teacher colleges"; revisit if needs be. There's stronger support for "colleges" over "schools" and keeping separate categories by default is an undesired outcome but given the limited discussion after multiple relistings this may need further consideration in a merged environment. Timrollpickering 10:10, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

: Option A:

: Propose merging :Category:Teachers colleges to :Category:Education schools

: Option B:

: Propose merging :Category:Education schools to :Category:Teachers colleges

: Propose renaming :Category:Education schools by country to :Category:Teachers colleges by country

: Propose renaming :Category:Education schools in China to :Category:Teachers colleges in China

: Propose renaming :Category:Education schools in Japan‎ to :Category:Teachers colleges in Japan

: Propose renaming :Category:Education schools in Poland‎ to :Category:Teachers colleges in Poland

: Propose renaming :Category:Education schools in Russia‎ to :Category:Teachers colleges in Russia

:Nominator's rationale: merge (option A) or reverse merge (option B). The previous attempt of merging :Category:Education schools and :Category:Teachers colleges failed, not because because anyone objected merging, but because there was an issue about the 'correct' name of the category. Here is a new attempt and please note that "no consensus" is worse than either of the two proposals because it will leave us with two categories with an identical scope. Also note that in option B a large number of country subcats have not been included in the nomination; the ones that have not been listed here should be decided upon individually, taking in mind WP:ENGVAR. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:50, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

  • Option A - there are only 2 articles (one in Zimbabwe, one in Turkey) and no subcats in :Category:Teachers colleges, created in 2016, long after :Category:Education schools. Also Teachers college is a redirect to Normal school. Just create :Category:Education schools in Turkey and :Category:Education schools in Zimbabwe for the 2 articles. Oculi (talk) 21:03, 12 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Option B:. I think "Education schools" invites misinterpretation. Rathfelder (talk) 15:34, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Prefer Teacher Training Colleges. I sampled a number of countries, mostly anglophone and Teachers' Colleges and Schools of Education (not Education Schools) seemed to predominate. My recollection of UK system is that Colleges of Education and Teacher Training Colleges were free-standing institutions training school-leavers to be teachers, whereas Schools of Education were providing a post-graduate Certificate of Education to those with a Batchelor's degree in another subject. Whatever the outcome, we need a single worldwide parent (and a "by country" parent. The national subcategories should reflect national usage. Categorisation should reflect their function, not their name. Peterkingiron (talk) 18:24, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
  • I Prefer Teacher Training Colleges, but this may be because I went to one. In the UK they were independent, but have subsequently become universities, or merging into them. Previously the universities ran Schools of Education. But I think we should avoid using the word school, because it invites misinterpretation. I think the word Teacher needs to appear. And we need to make it clear whether this category includes only independent organisations or also departments of universities.Rathfelder (talk) 09:03, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:05, 23 October 2018 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:05, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Comment. It should definitely be college, not school (or maybe both, to cover those that were part of universities). "School" is not commonly used for an independent tertiary institution outside the United States. Teacher training colleges would also be my preference, but I too am British and that was the common name for them here. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:47, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:BioWare companions ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Merge. Timrollpickering 10:05, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose merging :Category:BioWare companions to :Category:Video game sidekicks

:Nominator's rationale: Per WP:NARROWCAT, the subject does not merit such an overly specific category. As far as I can tell, pretty much all Bioware characters who have articles here are party members for the main character's party. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 14:14, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

  • Comment Since I originally created the category, I figure I might as well give the context for why I made it. I noticed a lot of overall coverage of BioWare companions taken in aggregate -- who was the best, the worst, what were recurring archetypes BioWare used and how game romance was handled, etc. So I felt it made a degree of sense to just give that a category outside of the usual franchise-specific character ones. But yes, the vast majority of articles we have on BW characters are on companions -- the obvious exceptions being Revan, Commander Shepard and some of the listy character articles, but these are rare enough that, even for a hypothetical person just searching for info on BioWare companions, they probably wouldn't have much of a problem. On the record I do think the idea of RPG party members is probably distinct from the more general idea of a 'sidekick', though I'm not now actually advocating that be split into a separate category. – The Millionth One (talk) (contribs) 00:28, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ℯxplicit 07:10, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:01, 23 October 2018 (UTC)

{{resize|91%|Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.}}

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:03, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

:Neutral. I guess there are enough articles that we could diffuse the main category. But, at the same time, it's not that many and it's not like the main category is large. Problem is, we do not have a video game sidekick article, so even the parent category's cross-cat is on a OR-ish narrow-cat grounds. I would lead towards merging if the overall consensus is on the fence on this. —  HELLKNOWZ   ▎TALK 11:08, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:2018 hardcore punk albums ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: Delete. Timrollpickering 10:03, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose deleting {{Lc|2018 hardcore punk albums}}

:Nominator's rationale: We don't keep by year/by genre albums categories (except for catch-all genres such as "Classical"). The two articles in the category are already part of the parent categories :Category:2018 albums and :Category:Hardcore punk albums so there's nothing to upmerge. Pichpich (talk) 01:31, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Delete per nom. Lugnuts Fire Walk with Me 14:20, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Delete. In complete agreement with the nominator. StarcheerspeaksnewslostwarsTalk to me 16:20, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

== Category:Employees of the National Museum of Natural History (France) ==

:The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

:The result of the discussion was: rename to :Category:National Museum of Natural History (France) people. From other cases, this seems to be the preferred form for this type of category. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:26, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

:* Propose renaming :Category:Employees of the National Museum of Natural History (France) to :Category:People associated with the National Museum of Natural History (France)

:Nominator's rationale: Technically, I suppose this expands the scope of the category a little bit but it makes it easier to fit inside its only natural parent category: :Category:Museum people by museum. Pichpich (talk) 01:18, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

:Support As I noted when I created this category, I copied the name from :Category:Employees of the Natural History Museum, London. I see now that there is also :Category:People associated with the Natural History Museum, London which includes the latter. Finally, I agree with the renaming. However, that expands the scope, and I wonder what to do with people who never worked with this Institution but donated their collection; are they "associated" or not? jeanloujustine (talk)

:* I'm equally fine with :Category:National Museum of Natural History (France) people. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:22, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

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:The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.